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Monday, August 04, 2008

THE REAL PROBLEM IS NOT TALKING ABOUT "IT" TO OUR CHILDREN, AT HOME AND IN SCHOOL

UOJ ARCHIVES - JULY 10, 2006

A noted Orthodox criminal defense attorney writes
e-mail: dbpesq@gmail.com

**************************************************

THE REAL PROBLEM IS NOT TALKING ABOUT "IT" TO OUR CHILDREN, AT HOME AND IN SCHOOL

PART 1

Before I write about "the real problem," which everyone has their own opinion about, and everyone is right about, I need to say a few words of introduction about the disingenuousness of Rabbi Avi Shafran.

Rabbi Shafran, whom I have never met, is one of the best "spin doctors" in the world. He is an amazing writer and he does the best job of defending, deflecting, spinning, distracting, etc. everyone from negative attention on Agudah and the Haredi world. I truly and sincerely admire him. And I admire the fact that many newspaper editors – most notably, Gary Rosenblatt at the Jewish Week – will rightfully give him a forum to respond any time he feels there is a need for an Agudah response. I enjoy an open dialogue and reading his/Agudah's point of view.

That said, his recent article entitled "A Matter of Orthodox Abuse" responding to Robert Kolker's NY Magazing article on the Kolko-Torah Temimah sexual abuse and cover-up lawsuits, was Rabbi Shafran at his best – and yet glaringly disingenuous. Robert Kolker himself has done a much better job of responding to Rabbi Shafran than I could ever do. Let me pick his article apart, however, with two additional points.

Rabbi Shafran attempts to quell the panic about sexual abuse in the Orthodox community with a two-pronged approach: (1) There are no statistics, so why assume it is so bad? On the contrary, it's probably not as bad as it is in other segments of the American population, because… (2) "A Torah-observant life does not lead to aberrant behavior; it helps prevent it… That fundamental Jewish truth that human inclinations are harnessed and controlled by Torah-life and Torah-study is self-evident to anyone truly familiar with the Orthodox community."

Let's take them one at a time. Let's first deal with a lack of statistics or a lack of information.

Imagine, if you will, that you are walking about five blocks from your home when you get a text message on your phone that your 4-year-old daughter fell down a flight of stairs inside your home, with no information about the extent of her injuries. Let's assume you do not have the presence of mind to call home, or you do and the line is busy. Do you: (A) assume the best, that she fell only a few steps, and onto carpeting and is resilient enough to stand up and walk it off – and therefore you walk home at a leisurely pace, OR do you (B) assume the worst, that she is severely injured with broken bones and you, therefore, run home to see what you can do to help?

Project the same hypothetical about hearing from a neighbor that there is smoke coming out of your living room window – with no one at home. Do you assume the fire is contained to, say, a waste basket and walk home leisurely or do you run home afraid your house is burning down?

Without commenting on the Kolko case, Rabbi Shafran admits that "abuse of children unquestionably exists in the Orthodox community," but gives you the impression that, although there are no statistics and no one – including him – knows the extent of the abuse, it is wise to assume that it's not so bad.

Rabbi Shafran, your (our) house is on fire, you don't know the extent of the fire, and you are taking a leisurely walk home – a "shpatzeir" – to check on it! How amazingly absurd! There is nothing more Jewish than when there is a problem and we don't know the extent of it, to assume the worst.

(By the way, notice how carefully worded his big "admission" is: He calls it "child abuse" avoiding the term "sexual abuse," so that what he is admitting to could be "potching on the tuchis too hard." He does not mention rabbis or teachers or even a school setting; instead he talks about "in the Orthodox community," with which, if pressed for details, he could say he means parental abuse. And by saying "Orthodox" rather than Haredi he could be pointing a finger at Modern Orthodox and imply that it's less of a problem (or non-existent) in the yeshivish and chasidish world… See, I told you he was good!)

His second prong of the attack is even more absurd than his first. We would all like to believe that a religious lifestyle and dedication to God means a more ethical and moral way of living – and for most people, it truly does. Furthermore, most Jews respect those of other religions who are "frum" within their beliefs. Most Jews will tell you that they'd rather have as a boss or neighbor "a frum goy" than a non-religious Jew. Yet, when we observed the Catholic priest scandal it didn't shock us. We were rather smug in our attitude. It seemed NOT to be inconsistent for us that there are large numbers (again, no statistics) of Catholic priests who are homosexual pedophiles. Why doesn't their situation cause us concern about ours? Is it just because we know that their religion is wrong? Certainly their most religious, most pious leaders, believe, act and preach virtually the same morals and ethics that we do. And yet, so many OF THEM are flawed. Could we not have as many, and possibly more?

And how does one define morality and ethics? Is it limited to sexual abuse and deviation? Or does it broadly include business ethics and money matters? Although there are no statistics, if I told you that a higher percentage of Orthodox Jews cheat on their taxes than, say, Protestant Americans, would that shock you? Would you be as offended and protest? Of course not. It seems to be accepted and acceptable – and may even be a source of pride, since some call it a "mitzvah" – that we lie on our 1040's and cheat Uncle Sam out of as much money as we feel we can get away with.

(I recently became aware of this scam: In a certain Chasidic community, a major girls high school has done away with 12 th grade. Why? See if you can follow this: Many of their girls get married at 18. They marry religiously, and not civilly. When they give birth to their children, they file for welfare as unwed mothers. They recently found out that unwed mothers who did NOT graduate high school are entitled to a greater stipend than those who did graduate. To make sure their girls avoid the temptation of getting a diploma, this school did away with 12th grade.)

Why are we so foolish, so "na'arish", as to believe that we frum Jews can tacitly agree that it is acceptable to file for food stamps and get section 8 housing even though we are earning too much money to qualify for it but because it's a cash business or we're getting paid off the books, and that this lack of morality would not affect our sexual morality? That when we rationalize one thing, why do we deny it will cause us to rationalize others?

When our sages said "Mitzvah goreres mitzvah, v'aveirah goreres aveirah," they didn't mean that an doing an aveirah would cause us to do the same sin again. They meant that rationalizing one sin will cause us to rationalize another sin.

STAY TUNED FOR PART 2 IN WHICH I GET TO THE REAL PROBLEM.

204 comments:

1 – 200 of 204   Newer›   Newest»
NIRC ALUMNUS said...

UOJ begged shraggi and sheftel to answer him. Why don't they t answer him? They don't use the assurdike internet, of course. We know that. A family member tried to communicate with uoj for whatever reason. UO preferred arms length communication. No communication. The hanhala doesn't need publicity other than what they plant. If he were a real friend, he'd have given more money and been in touch. We'd have honored him at the dinner. Why should they answer, uo? You've gored their ox, slaughtered their calf, fed them to the wolves. You are Poison.

They are the hanhola, you, their ben sorrer u-moreh. A bum! A rosho! (let's say it again, and again, and again, maybe we'll feel better). If he could harm US and our father's fresh, sacred, venerated memory like THIS!!!! This is toevah. This is evil. This is bad publicity.

Can you imagine the debate between the rosh kollel, the roshei yeshiva and the lawyers. All insist any matters must be settled in Bais Din, never in civil courts. Arkoyas??? The thought pains us that any Jew would dream of arkoyos. Arkoyos are assur. A shanda. A chillul Hashem. UOJ is a goy. He is a shaygetz, a bum, worse, he is the enemy. He hates Toyreh. He must hate Toyreh. He will never be honored. He hates roshei yeshiva. He's a koyfer b'ikkar. He's abusing us. bad, the worst. We're so good, the best. Outside of Bais Din, we might lose. If the truth is known, we'll never be Lakewood. Talmidim may leave. He is stabbing us, killing us. Let's be mispallel, daven, raise more money, anything but the truth.

Anonymous said...

You are good, uoj, true to your mission. Your ends are pure even if your means are interpreted by some as mean. You're doing good work. The spin chasers, those who are only fooling themselves, the corrupt and politically correct - should take heed.

Anonymous said...

To all you doubters out there:

Here is my analysis of UOJ. No, I am not a psychologist, but I believe that it is important to point out the obvious to the blog audience - to those who think the worst about a really good, deep, caring individual. This comes from following the blog for quite some time and from a review of UOJ's old website. I think that UOJ would agree that my analysis is pretty accurate.

UOJ is an extremely honest individual. His word is as good as gold. He is truly bothered by the lack of integrity that he sees in the frum community. It eats away at his very core. Unlike 99% of the people, he actually thinks and actually cares.

UOJ has done more than his share of good - an activist some would call him. He is not just interested in his 4 amos. Hypocrisy and abuse of power disturb him to no end. He has a special sensitivity for this and has picked up on these things even as a child. He tried to believe in the system and the leaders as he is a good, frum, learned Jew, but decided, at one point, that enough was enough. He had witnessed too much - probably more than many others because of his connections to the higher-ups.

Despite this, I have a feeling that he is not a bitter person in his family life. Most likely, he lives a life that is quite fulfilled - not the oger-like, divorced, loner life as some have tried to portray him as living. He has seen the ugly and knows better.

UOJ decided to voice his opinions on his blog and expose the corruption. Some are unconventional, but after analysis, you may realize are more right than wrong. I may disagree with other opinions. There are tactics, especially some taken early on (such as the A, B and C list of Gedolim), that I wish that UOJ would acknowledge were in poor taste. But an example of an unpopular, yet valid opinion, was UOJ "outing" the rabbonim who attend the weddings that violate the very takonas that they established. I am sure that many would say, "How dare he start up with Gedolim," but really how can these leaders engage in this duplicity. Yes, I may not express myself in the same manner or I may say the same thing privately (as I am sure many of you would), but when UOJ brings it to the public's attention, he is a Rasha! That is ridiculous.

However, whatever one may think about UOJ's opinions, I am very confident that he would never accuse a person of being a molester without first having credible evidence. That is what UOJ is about. Honest, but hard hitting. Out to make changes. UOJ does not engage in the Echad B'Peh V'Ecahd B'Lev games that the Organizations have played for so long.

To those who think because UOJ has expressed some outlandish opinions this discredits his credibility on the molestation issue, you are very shallow indeed. Analyze the person and you will see how wrong you are. Unfortunately, because you don't like the man's opinions, you can't accept truth from him. What a shame. While we can criticize UOJ for some of his tactics and opinions, his credibility on molestations is PURE and UNTAINTED.

Let us also not forget the great good that he has done for the victims. It is hard to believe that one person could have accomplished so much in such a short period of time.

Anonymous said...

HOT NEWS FLASH !!!!

Earlier today I receieved inside information. The one who hatched the idea of giving Rabbi Leizorowitz of Yagdil Torah a farewell dinner was none other then REB YOSEF ROSENBLUM !!

The idea was to give leizorwitz an appearence of innocence. This same Rabbi Rosenblum is fire against the internet. He went so far as to say that if a melamad saw something on the internet from the chasam sofer and repeated it in class the chasam sofer himself will spit in his face when he comes up to shomayim.

I guess Rabbi Leizorowitz didn't become a menuval from the internet so then it's ok.

Anonymous said...

Considering UOJ's close relationship with the Neubergers, I think that UOJ is a Ner Israel Alumnus.

Anonymous said...

Excellent letter, but for this:

"Most Jews will tell you that they'd rather have as a boss or neighbor 'a frum goy' than a non-religious Jew. "

Who are "most Jews" here, and would they really rather work for, or live next door to, let's say, a right-wing, evangelical ("frum") Christian who thinks all Jews will go to hell, than a decent secular Jew? This was written by a nice "frum goy:"

http://www.chick.com/reading/tracts/0014/0014_01.asp

Truth Hurts said...

Funny because a Rosenblum speech is posted on Dei'ah VeDibur - just Google it. Read it and you;ll see what a sicko he is.

Anonymous said...

UOJ is UOJ. His mommie loves him. His daddy is proud of him. The yeshivah velt doesn't like him so much. He can't really be one of them to do what he does. He cannot stand for truth if their Toirah is truth. Their Toirah is yeshiva. What Toireh does he possess? Where are his plaques? Show us? Prove we are wrong. And that is precisely what he intends to do. He, our surgeon, dermatologist and dry cleaner in one battling cancer, stains and acne.

The gedoylim must think, this is the end of the world. P'nei hador k'pnei hakelev. Everyone whose hand we limply shake or do not shake is a dog. Their chelek in Toirah is through giving us money. We believe in that. We believe in Zevulun. We are Yissachar. We have him on our team. He writes books, gives well attended speeches. He'll do the right thing. UOJ will become UNpopular. We will ABSOLUTELY assur the internet once and for all. We will save klal Yisroel from the, mammish, reshoyim peshayim. We'll show UOJ who runs klal Yisroel, how they listen to gedoylim, how truth is covered up.

boog said...

Waiting for your Round #2, ESQ.

Emes V'Yatziv.

ADMITNOTHING said...

UOJ......

You need to "out" all of the child abusers and give the yeshivahs a chance to prtect themselves and fire them for the following reasons:

1. The Yeshivahs in most cases have been covering up for them and do have a price to pay,

2. Parents of students in those Yeshivahs should be able to mobilize against the yeshivah to demand that they fire the sex offender during the summer months before yshivah starts, and

3. The abusive rebbe could find employment somewhere else if the firing is not made public.

Binny Freedman said...

During a federal investigation into Boro Park shenanigans in the 1990s, a chussid matter of factly told investigators that he "was helping the Rebbe not pay taxes.". In response to blank stares and a bunch of "HUH?"s, he answered, "Yes, no one pays taxes."

Shmiel Kahn said...

Remember before the IRS crackdown when no one on 13th Ave charged sales tax?

Moshe Wein said...

Where does Mr. "HOT NEWS FLASH" get his information that Rav Rosenbloom was behind the seudas prayda for Leizerowitz?

Anonymous said...

"Remember before the IRS crackdown when no one on 13th Ave charged sales tax?"

isn't sales tax a state isssue?

Anonymous said...

Over 400 comments on the last thread with comment moderation.

Not bad!

Anonymous said...

Chuck,

Where is OrthoRev?

Seems odd that he hasn't been heard from in so long.

Did UOJ ban him?

Did the other side get to him?

Just wondering.

I heard that Tuvia and OrthoRev are Siamese Twins.

Anonymous said...

Boog,

What should we do to implement your plan?

Please talk tachlis.

Anonymous said...

Any news on Torah Temimah?

Julius Berman said...

Sales tax is a local issue but another rampant problem in Boro Park is federal, like charity fraud in billing every personal item imaginable to your shtiebel, wether the "house of worship" is real or imaginary.

Anonymous said...

UOJ appeears to be banning posts that question the veracity of his claims. Looking for more credibility on the victim stories and how they were verified.

Anonymous said...

"another rampant problem in Boro Park is federal, like charity fraud"

- isn't it a mitzvah to take the goyim for what they're worth?

Pfeffer Brothers formerly of Lakewood's Irvington said...

"- isn't it a mitzvah to take the goyim for what they're worth?"

Especially when you rent a car.

Un-Orthodox Jew said...

Anon above,

I AM ONLY CENSORING ANY POSTS THAT COULD EVEN SLIGHTLY HURT THE VICTIMS! SLAM AWAY AT ME, DO NOT DOUBT THE INTEGRITY OF THE VICTIMS EVER. THEY'VE BEEN THROUGH THAT FROM THE GANGSTER ENABLERS!

OJ Simpson said...

"UOJ appeears to be banning posts that question the veracity of his claims. Looking for more credibility on the victim stories and how they were verified. "
______

You're the type of guy that would listen to a victim break down crying in front of you after telling you his whole story and tell him he made it up and you need more proof and witnesses and all kinds of stuff along those lines. So what's the point?

Are you just looking to poke a hole in the evidence, mr. sherlock holmes? Let the professionals handle that. I assure you there was no chain of custody or other foolproof method, there is no DNA evidence or CCTV footage. An animal like you will never be convinced until it happens to your son.

Anonymous said...

"I AM ONLY CENSORING ANY POSTS THAT COULD EVEN SLIGHTLY HURT THE VICTIMS! SLAM AWAY AT ME, DO NOT DOUBT THE INTEGRITY OF THE VICTIMS EVER. THEY'VE BEEN THROUGH THAT FROM THE GANGSTER ENABLERS!"

Not slammimng. Just looking for something more to go on. You are asking that we think evilly of a man we know in another way. Surely you understand the predicament of those who know RME as a good person. Can you at least demonstrate that there have been interactionss with NIRC about this?

Anonymous said...

"DO NOT DOUBT THE INTEGRITY OF THE VICTIMS EVER"

please establish credibly first, that there ARE victims.

question: what is the next step with NIRC? do you have enough to go to the papers with?

Anonymous said...

OJ,

Get real - the guy asked an honest question - as demonstrated by his response to UOJ's reply to his original comment.

You drew conclusions about his character that are unsupported by the evidence presented.

Did someone say evidence??? What evidence, OJ??? If the glove don't fit...

Go back and look for the real killer...

Anonymous said...

To Moshe Wein:

1. I have a connection in Yagdil Torah and

2. My friend's grandchild was molested by leizorowitz (and he and his wife know this as well).

Shmuel said...

1. "Isn't it a mitzvah to take the goyim for all their worth?"
Sure it is, and it's a mitzvah on the goyim's part to catch you, prosecute you and incarcerate you for years for doing your mitzvah. So, happy mitzvahs, and soon you, too, will be eating three glatt kosher meals a day and davening up daf yomi in the Big House!
2. Are you kidding about firing a child molester privately SO HE CAN GET EMPLOYMENT ELSEWHERE? Are you completely mad? Shall we take a page from the Catholic Church and just reassign rabbinic molesters to other yeshiviz? UOJ, help me out on this! Fire that poster!

Book of Quotables said...

Funny how the Yeshivos have been trying for years to get my respect and they've only partially succeeded, whereas uoj has gotten my attention and respect in a matter of months without ever asking for it.
"One who seeks honor chases it away, while one who shuns honor has it chase after him. "
"A child can discern a good man from an evil man and avoids the latter."
I know the truth when I see it because the malach taught it to me already.
If we only were capable of having a dialogue with our leaders instead of a constant monologue. They need to understand how to let go of the button on their radio and listen to the other side for a little bit. Maybe all that static is us trying to be heard.

Alexander Gold said...

UOJ has to be very careful about posts that hurt the victims, especially with Margo's agents trying to sneak them in. Margo needs to be taken care of so that he stops bullying and badmouthing the victims.

Allen Rothenberg said...

Is there anyone who has slipped and fallen on YTT property who could use a good ambulance chaser, I mean lawyer?

Anonymous said...

"Get real - the guy asked an honest question - as demonstrated by his response "

thank you fellow Anon. To your point, if this blog is about truth, lying for the sake of tuth would be not only OXY moronic, but plain old moronic.

X talmid of thug Rosenblum said...

Anonymous said...
HOT NEWS FLASH !!!!

Earlier today I receieved inside information. The one who hatched the idea of giving Rabbi Leizorowitz of Yagdil Torah a farewell dinner was none other then REB YOSEF ROSENBLUM !!

------------------------------
This is the same Thuggish Rosenblum that killed out the Slifkin family,the Reiner family and others.
This is the same Thug Rosenblum, which ordered the capitol hotel in Lakewood to close. Forcing countless Kosher buissiness that were located to fall on thier faces.
He runs the Rabbonishe Mafia in Brooklyn and Lakewood and BMG uses him when they need to do some dirty work in town!
Does anyone have a picture of this monster ?
Please post one if you do.
He should be ousted on his Hairy old shriveled BUTT!

Tuvya said...

UOJ said,

I AM ONLY CENSORING ANY POSTS THAT COULD EVEN SLIGHTLY HURT THE VICTIMS! SLAM AWAY AT ME, DO NOT DOUBT THE INTEGRITY OF THE VICTIMS EVER. THEY'VE BEEN THROUGH THAT FROM THE GANGSTER ENABLERS!

If that is the case, why wont you publish ANY of my posts?

boog said...

To anon:

The Oilem is nowhere near ready for suggestions as evidenced by the nitwit poster who suggested that a rebbe fired for sex abuse in one yeshiva should be canned in enough time so that he could still possibly find employement in another Yeshiva. This is normal? What happened, the chulent went to your brain?

The message is not getting through with enough clarity.

UOJ has clearly demonstrated that our yeshivas are dens of sex pedophiia iniquity.

1. YTT
2. Ner Yisroel
3. Waterbury
4. Yeshiva of Brooklyn
5. Gerrer Mesifta Dormitory in Boro Park--SHUT DOWN.
6. Mirrer Dormitory in Flatbush
7.Camp Agudah

Which Mosad/Camp is going to be "outed" next? The way things are going, next months Gay Pride Parade in Yerushalayim can easily have their own large Chareidi contingent. Guys, just make sure you shower before you march. Some of your "fryer" compatriots have sensitive noses.

And Health Care experts are worried out the impending arrival of the Avian Flu?
We have an epidemic right here, right now and scumbags like Shafran and Rosenblum enable this tinaf to continue?! hey Rosenblum...did you really make that comment about the Chasam Sofer and the internet?

You need mantra medicine until this penetrates your psyche and subconscious. Repeat the following, 400 times daily.
______________________________________
Registration, Fingerprinting, DNA sample for any person hired by our Yeshivas has to be made compulsory not voluntary.

Revocation of Tax Exempt status and all forms of financial aid until this policy is implemented by all yeshivas and camps.

Same rules and requirements for our
yeshivas as for the Public School System.
_______________________________________

Until this is accomplished, your children and grandcildren are at very high risk. This Blog clearly shows that we are dealing with drek and evil "leadership" whose only objective is to wield and remain in power with our money and at the expense of our Tinokes Shel Bais Rabon.

They will kneel, bend to our will, and do right by our children only when threathened to lose what they hold most dear: Their wallets.

Tuvya Is A LOSER said...

C'mon Tuvya you hypocrite, if you insist UOJ identify himself, you should do the same. After all, you are now also the proud author of a blog that slings mud at accusers.

Full disclosure Tuvya. How are you related / connected to an accused pedophile or crook like Pinter who is constantly bashed on UOJ?

Anonymous said...

tevele, darling. We have and do miss you. But, we expect you to respond, to fight the good fight, to use your mouth, pen and good looks in such respected publications as The Jewish Press, The Jewish Observer, Yated, Hamoidia, Mishpocha and Country Yossie magazines to give frumkayt a good name. Boruch Hashem. Boruch Hashem for amechod.

To suggest that all of k'lal Yisroel is becoming gay would be delusional. The numbers, of course, are low; the numbers of victims are relatively low, but DOES this lamentable fact EXCUSE those who have taken advantage of them? Molesters, it can be argued, impact negatively on future relationships and create creepy thoughts for life. Those who knew and made believe everything was fine need to be educated that theirs is the way of achzoriyus, cruelty. Sexual abuse is psychologically damaging. Women have turned harassment into a prosecutable offense. Why? Because unwanted advances, psychological manipulation, being hit on, is not a turn-on. The experience can have long lasting repercussions. Is this what you wanted to tell us, tuvyi? Tell it to us in the Jewish Week again and again, and about how great the frum community is compared with poshay Yisroel. Let us know YOU understand the extent of wrongdoing when molestation occurs, that the Agoodah actually encouraged the Catholic Church in coming clean, that the Agudah, representing extreme, fanatic, Chareidi Orthodoxy, is frummer than that? Good to know. Now, all we need is a court case for all the evidence to emerge and then you can go to Bais Din and cover the peshara for hamoidia. ha ha, moy, tuvi, dea.

Neurologist said...

Allen Rothenberg,

Are you going to stop running ads in the Jewish Press now that you get a free plug on UOJ?

Shea Fishman says he can't recall what happened. Did he slip and fall one day while visiting Margo?

Anonymous said...

Welcome back Tuvia,

Your blog is lousy.

Let us know how many victims come flocking to you.

I bet you UOJ wins by a shutout!

Anonymous said...

Tuvie, your pain fills us with pain. We feel your hurt, your frustration. But, you are supposed to be busy at work, not working on this blog. You can write for hamoidia. Let the frum velt know how great we are, how evil the internet is, how dangerous and threatening. We know it's not just pornography you're worried about and unfair accusations. It's the very future of klal Yisroel, Toyra, the gedoylim, the moetzes, the yeshivos, the Am hanivchar, the Ribboinoi shel Oilam, all upon your shoulders.

UOJ hasn't allowed all of my posts either. I've defended RME and uoj refused to offend the victims by accepting that very weak argument. He is a talmud chochom, but Lo zu darkah shel Toirah. If these claims are lies, an innocent man would curse his critics. He'd scream bloody murder and sue, in civil court. LIBEL. SLANDER. DEFAMATION OF CHARACTER. He and every innocent rebbe would take on the world with venom and righteous anger. They would deny the charges. This is what uoj maintains. I'm afraid he's right. If I accused the agoodah of deception, you'd say I was a sonay Yisroel. If anyone blogs here, with chutzpah, ayn lahem chelek l'oilam haba. We have cursers ready to curse, flawed rabbeim already teaching, and tuvya ready to defend them. Help the Agudah's defense in court, amechod.

This esquire's post provides very thoughtful criticism of your spin. Go spin your wheels in Newsday.

Anonymous said...

tuvi vowed he would not go away, uoj. A neder is a neder, a shavua, a shevua, an isur, an isur, a konam, not a condom. He's very frum. We must listen to him so that he can save klal Yisroel and justify his position. It's for parnosseh, don't you understand? The same argument as he could make for every incompetent rebbe.

Anyone who questions roshei yeshiva related to other roshei yeshiva are apikorsim. Lo lamad, lo asah, moes es ha-achayrim, sonay es hachachomim, moinaya es haacherim, koyfer b'mitzvois, koyfer b'ikkar. See. It's all there. If you leave yeshiva, you're not frum. If you distance yourself from a yeshiva dinner, you're a moinea from them collecting your gelt. And if so, you're an apikores. Tuvi and the yeshivois win. Do not pass go and do not collect two hundred dollars.

copy and past this link for a picture of Rosenblum. I think this is him: said...

http://www.oorah.org/images/rosenblum.jpg

Anonymous said...

Rosenblum did much to hurt me too, but, it's too personal to describe it on this blog. He belongs to the Erev Rav RAHbonnim along with a whole bunch of others, including some in the holy city of Lakewood.

Anonymous said...

I've just seen tuvya's blog. If he's for real, he means well. He wants to be fair. Don't we all?

But, his argument that he would post on a blog that his former employer molested him for revenge is counter intuitive. Normal people don't do this or think this way and the numbers of cases which reflect sicko thinking are limited. When it happens, with a quick inquiry one can discern whose stories sound plausible and whose are not. When multiple stories, with specific details which do not exaggerate the problem surface, there's smoke. If witnesses are prepared to testify, there's fire.

If there is mockery on this blog, that's unfortunate. The topic is serious, the charges and victims, too.

The Mayven said...

It's simple why Tuvya started his blog. His alter ego Shafran / Zweibel can now proclaim at the next feel-good Agudah meeting with Hungarian baal habatim who have nothing to do, that there now exists a medium to "hit back" at UOJ.

How lame.

Joel Gold said...

UOJ,

Are you going to be targeting Modern Orthodox abusers and enablers? Saul Berman, who was covering for rapist Gafni's rear has just been hired by Avi Weiss at YCT (Yeshivat Chovavei Torah).

Auto Report World Editors said...

Tuvya, I'm still waiting for you to tell us one example of how you have done tshuvah for a sin or corrected a character flaw in your life.

Being the wholly righteous individual that you are, perhaps you can give us some guidance on how you got to be so righteous.

See, I'm trying not to be a bitter, lowlife loser and I need a role model. I'm pretty sure that I have the lowlife part down, but you could probably share a few tips on being a bitter loser.

Anonymous said...

You think S B esq. enabled mg? c'mon. He's a lawyer, an intellectual, pro women, without gender bias. How can you prove that HE more than any others covered ganify's anything?

Anonymous said...

tuvya is l'shem shomayim.

He seeks truth.

He doesn't want anyone's blood. He has no dogs. He lives in Flatbush. He is also entitled to free speech, and it's unfair to demand a baal teshuvah repeat their transgressions to YOU. To the Ribbbono shel Olam, fine, proper. To you, why? You won't find Jews like tuvya in lynch mobs. They might be fine for jury duty.

boog said...

tuvya;

You shtick drek;

You complain about UOJ censoring your posts, yet you did the same thing to him on your Blog.

Matersdorfer yid said...

I just saw that pic of thuggy Rosenblum.
They should hang him by his gartil and shave his beard off.
I bet he and PEE. Sheinputz are related..

Auto Report World Editors said...

Re Tuvya

He has no dogs.

Are we Muslims? Dogs are wonderful companions. R. S.Z.Auerbach permitted playing with them on Shabbas.

He is also entitled to free speech,

Not on someone else's blog.

and it's unfair to demand a baal teshuvah repeat their transgressions to YOU. To the Ribbbono shel Olam, fine, proper. To you, why?

Because he is demanding that I emulate his hashkafa and behavior. If he's such a saint, let him show me how he became a saint.

Or at least he could acknowledge he is capable of sin.

Anonymous said...

the government is an organization that all races and creeds try to milk as much as possible. There are no ethical issues in taking money from them outside of lying or fraud. If I choose not to graduate high school because it will get me more government money, there is nothing wrong with that. Just as there's nothing wrong with all tax loopholes etcetra. If you're eligible for government money, you have no obligation to say "do i really deserve it". So I have no issue with a school where the children don't graduate high school as long as their is no fraud. You must distinguish between fraud and loophole.

Anonymous said...

uoj, do you think all the moisdois are planning to just ignore u, the internet, responsibility? Just make believe u'r not there. Bochurim have no access, thank Gd. Only the moishav laytzim know, and who r they anyway? Admit no wrong, and nothing's wrong...

Dear editor,

what kind of dog did reb shlomo zalman have in HIS house. just curious.

gross said...

the government is an organization that all races and creeds try to milk as much as possible. There are no ethical issues in taking money from them outside of lying or fraud. If I choose not to graduate high school because it will get me more government money, there is nothing wrong with that. Just as there's nothing wrong with all tax loopholes etcetra. If you're eligible for government money, you have no obligation to say "do i really deserve it". So I have no issue with a school where the children don't graduate high school as long as their is no fraud. You must distinguish between fraud and loophole.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

You must be joking. Of course there are “ethical” issues with taking government money under false pretenses. Can’t you distinguish right from wrong? Is is admirable or even moral to encourage a society of nothings, bred like gypsies (or worse) with arms outstretched to receive government handouts? Don’t we want better for ourselves? What kind of “loophole” is this? Is this the kind of “frum” that is “superior” to the “modern” counterpart? The famous “fifth volume” of Shulchan Aruch is common sense. It has been said that without it the other four are meaningless.

Your comment is really troublesome and I think it represents a pervasive problem with Charedi philosophy in that the “letter of the Law” is followed without paying attention to the “spirit of the Law” that common sense alone should dictate. A close friend of mine once told me that he never heard a bad word about anyone come out his father’s mouth, yet he never hears his father say “I can’t say that it’s Lashon Hara.” His father simply doesn’t speak badly of others.

He continued “Now, if hypothetically the Gedolim came out with a ruling that Lashon Hara is indeed permissible my father wouldn’t change.” The reason is because he simply “doesn’t talk bad about people.” He himself doesn’t need the term “Lashon Hara” to know so. I wonder how many frum people would suddenly, like robots, decide “now I can probably gossip because it’s muttar!”

So, what I’m saying is: Don’t be a robot and use your brain! It’s what “ethics” is all about.

Aaron Thomas said...

UOJ,

Ashrecha, Ma Tov Chelkecha!!! Keep up the great work!! However, I must point out that you weren't the first to expose "Rabbanim" and open the eyes of a community to the perverse cycle of abuse,corruption, and cover-up that is being perpetrated against us. I pre-dated you by at least 3 years in taking on some Chicago gangsters(mentioned earlier in your blog), Danny & Margie Shabat who molested my son, and a whore/"rabbi" who defended them, Shmuel Fuerst. You can read all about it on MY website,
http://www.projecttruth.info/thomas.html

Anonymous said...

It is fraud.
Because Dina Dmalchusa Dina says If you get married by a Rabbi or clergyman, he must make sure that you have your civil marriage papers prior to marring you off.
So yes . you are deceiviong the government. and that is fraud.

Yankel said...

Anonymous said...

the government is an organization that all races and creeds try to milk as much as possible. There are no ethical issues in taking money from them outside of lying or fraud. If I choose not to graduate high school because it will get me more government money, there is nothing wrong with that. Just as there's nothing wrong with all tax loopholes etcetra. If you're eligible for government money, you have no obligation to say "do i really deserve it". So I have no issue with a school where the children don't graduate high school as long as their is no fraud. You must distinguish between fraud and loophole.

Everything you say is true - but even so, it misses the point completely, I fear.

Yes, you are correct that exploiting a loophole in welfare policy is not illegal. But to say that whole populations of frum people are acting in ways that are not, techincally, illegal is to damn them with very, very faint praise. Is "not illegal" what we expect and desire from ourselves? Is "not illegal" the highest madreigah to which we can aspire? I truly hope not.

The attitude behind the exploitation of such loopholes is one of entitlement: "I deserve this extra money, so I will bend over backwards in order to qualify for it." No one forces married couples to be legally married, no one forces schools to graduate its graduates - but come on! These entitlements were meant for people with no spouse at all, not for people with extra-legal spouses. These were meant for people with no education, not for people whose education exists everywhere except on paper. Do you think that taking such monies harms no one? It harms tax-payers (including many frum yidden) who must bear the extra cost of this not technically illegal activity. It harms people who would otherwise qualify, if only there was more money in the program.

But those who take the money, those who practice such geneivische schtick (for that's what it is, really), feel that they are entitled. So they take it.

Yes, you are right: "all races and creeds try to milk" the government "as much as possible." So what? Aren't we frum yidden? Don't we have a Torah that tells us to be honest? Shouldn't we strive to better than all the other races and creeds? But no, we strive to pull as much schtick as possible, because we can. Because we're entitled to it.

And what else are we entitled to? What other rules can we bend in order to get what we want, what we feel we deserve? What can we rationalize? Can we lie, cheat and steal to get kavod? How about putting others down? And what can we do to satisfy perverse sexual desires? Can we lie about that too? And still insist on our kavod? (Yes, it's a stretch, I know. But still.)

Anonymous said...

UOJ

If you are so UNAFRAID

why don't you sign your name?

YOU COWARD.

On a lighter note...
Did anybody inquire about movie rights?

Auto Report World Editors said...

what kind of dog did reb shlomo zalman have in HIS house. just curious.

I have no idea if he owned a dog or not. He did say it was permissible to pet one on Shabbas, that they are equivalent to a toy and thus not muktzah.

A friend of mine and his family left careers in the Soviet Union so they could live as Jews in the USA. He described a particular form of frumspeak that involves a simple question where the upgoing inflection at the end implies clear disapproval of non-comforming behavior.

You have a dog???
You ride a bicycle???
You go camping???

Speaking of camping. I know a family that lives here in the Detroit area. Complete and utter frummies. He's a nice man. They just left for their annual trek to the mountains in New York. Now I don't really understand the appeal of packing up your family so you can hang out in what hardly sounds like bucolic splendor. Bungalow colonies aren't getting close to nature and seeing the glory of Hashem's creation - they are simply moving Brooklyn to a place with more trees.

If this family had headed north instead of a 12 hr drive east, within 6 hours they could have been in the middle of old growth forest on the edge of one of the world's largest bodies of fresh water.

Anonymous said...

UOJ where are you on this subject???

Anonymous said...

UOJ where are you on this subject?

http://abusedhassid.blogspot.com/

Anonymous said...

"the real problem is not talking about it."

If it refers to sexual molestation, many schools have started to, maybe not your beloved chassidim, but watch, the agudah will sponsor special materials soon. They will be in the forefront, the great avengers. Most kids know that their bodies are their own. Do they need to be told, warned, if anyone bothers you, complain. That's not so hard to do.

So, uo, what is "it?" Talking about sex? Some do. Talking about fake frum rabbeim? Some do. Corrupt moisdois? They all are. Some bright young minds are perceptive enough and don't have to be told how to play the game.

In Camp Agudah I watched how the biggest fakers were the most rewarded. I think I was seven or eight when I discovered this depressing truth. It bothered me then and nothing has really changed. Talking about "it," why will that change "it?" Must we wait?

Anonymous said...

The moysdas and the aguda seem to have a death wish. uoj is not demanding some "rush to judgment" scenario. But at least do something !! avi shafran said 2 weeks ago more should be done and it will be. Nu, Avi what's happening ??

rav eliashev sent rabbi dunner to india to check out the wig situation. avi, will the aguda be sending a rov into the yeshivas to check if there is any molestation??

I don't think so.

Anonymous said...

Another blogger said, "it is fraud.
Because Dina Dmalchusa Dina says."

Bochurim can be kicked out of yeshiva if they're caught on this blog and they shouldn't be talking to dina.

Is fraud "it?"

Anonymous said...

Frum people don't have dogs in their homes, based upon the gemara. They don't play with them on Shabbos either other than behind closed doors. Those who do are marked for mocking, nebech, a modern Orthodox alternative lifestyle.

Today's gedoilim would never pasken that way. They wouldn't vacation in Woodstock either.

UOJ is not a coward, just watching his back. If the Jewish world weren't crazy, he could move out of the asylum.

"it" not about "it" used to be ncsy's themesong, I vaguely remember. Is that "it?"

Anonymous said...

By the way, this government is supposed to be a republic not a democracy, and taxation without representation is against the constitution so it is illegal. No one really has to pay taxes, except that the IRS is like the mafia and they can get away with tax collection. I got this info online on a website called http://www.givemeliberty.org/

Anonymous said...

Did anyone notice that in the letters sent by the camps about sex abuse, they recommend parents should tell their kids if touched to come forward and tell the camps and they will be protected.

Why exactly should we (according to Agudas Yisroel) be telling parents to lie like that to their kids. Camps will OF COURSE not protect them. They will do anything possible to protect themselves. When was the last time any Jewish camp called the police?

It's a "chucha v'tlula" (i.e. bogus). Why don't we ever just call the police like normal people? Why do we make our kids suffer more than children from any other culture, race, or ethnic group. No, Avi Shafran, we don't have more molesters, we just do less about it so it seems like more.

JWB said...

jewishwhistleblower Says:

July 10th, 2006 at 10:44 am
While it is fair to be critical, suspicious and wary of what has been posted, just like ANYTHING you hear or read (to the extent it does not have a history or track record), I believe you are completely incorrect in claiming:

>owing to his cowardice, laziness, incompetence, cowardice,
>laziness, incompetence, and overall
>disregard for the cause for which he’s ostensibly fighting.

If UOJ is correct, and my information is that he is, the powerful rabbonim of Baltimore have been protecting several prominant sexual predators over the years. If you had bothered to do basic research into cases like the Shmuel Juravel, Matis Weinberg and Alan J. Horowitz cases you would discover that there is a real problem in Baltimore and what UOJ is doing appears to be the only way to address it. The leadership of Ner Israel are a symptom and part of that problem.

How do we fight an organized powerful connected group that has protected predators and silenced victims? Sexual predators who get the resources and assistance of the powerful community leadership? Sexual predators who are assisted in geting parnasah and relocation when things get too hot for them in the community? People like sexual predators Shmuel Juravel and Rabbi Alan J. Horowitz.

UOJ is not a journalist and makes no claim to be one. Do you have to believe anything UOJ or I say? Absolutely not. Does a blog posting = the NY times? Do blog posting have more credibility than a person standing on a soapbox on the corner ranting? So what is your point? UOJ gains credibilty by the fact that allegations he posts are found credible.

Does our constitution or Jewish law require you to give your name and address to those you fight who protect and our sexual predators? UOJ has no obligation whatsoever to give up a name. As long as UOJ speaks the truth, UOJ’s speech is protected.

Claiming he is a coward?

Ridiculous. What would his name add or detract to his claims? Ultimately, it is the survivors who will tell their stories. The problem is finding and organizing them. Many of us have been aware of several of those named on the UOJ blog, we have no doubt based on our information that those particular people should be named. Our problem is that we either lack sufficient documentation or survivors willing to come forward. The consequences for any one person coming forward are significant. If UOJ is able to gather and organize a group of survivors than UOJ should certainly be praised for that effort. What you characterize as cowardice is in fact UOJ not being stupid enough to believe the community will protect a whistleblower.

Ellie Hiller, was the whistle-blower, in the Lanner case. Did using his own name end Lanner? Do you recall what the leadership of the community did to Ellie and his family? Did it stop Lanner? No he contined to abuse children for another decade.

Have you seen what Jewish Renewal and Rabbi Berman did to Gafni’s opponents?

How about what Rabbi Fuerst did to Aaron Thomas in Chicago? And who is reporting or taking action on that outrage? Certainly not your colleagues.

The Jewish community needs UOJs simply because our leadership refuses to address these problems. Are UOJs and JWBs a good thing? Absolutely not. It means our community leadership has utterly and completly failed us. The fact that we exist and are taken seriously means a vaccum exists and as all vaccums, it is ultimately filled. Untill our community chooses to have any mechanism for dealing with these problems, we are it.

Lazy?

Quite the contrary, what he has organized in the Kolko case demonstrates the opposite.

Incompetence?

I have no idea what the basis for your claim is.

Overall disregard for the cause for which he’s ostensibly fighting?

SIW you are the journalist, we are not. Our job isn’t to put together an expose worthy of the Jewish Week. Our job is simply to stand and expose the corruption in our community any way we can. Don’t judge us by the standards you expect of journalists, we are not journalists. Your jouro-centrist world view is absurd and unhelpful. People are not journalists. The standards by which we speak and make statements do not need to rise to the level required in the Washington Post. Further, I would make the claim that so far UOJ has a far better record in a few months than the Jewish Press or Jewish Voice and Opinion after years, even decades.

What distinguishes anonymous UOJ from the anonymous Jewish Press editorial board?
1) UOJ does not claim to be a journalist nor claim to adhere to any such journalistic standards.
2) UOJ has a far better track record.

UOJ’s campaign is no different that hundreds that have been conducted by private citizens in similar circumstances in other religions communities. The only unique aspect is that he is doing it it the Orthodox Jewish community.

We are entitled, in fact obligated by Jewish law to speak out against evil. But no where are we required to do so where we would be putting ourselves in danger. And if we gave out our names, we would be. No where are we required to meet some jourtnalistic standard. Not according to the Constitution, not according to halacha.

It’s easy to say UOJ has disregard for the cause for which he’s ostensibly fighting, but based on the information he claims to have, where would you suggest he take it? What community institution would do anything? What journalists? The journalists in Baltimore won’t even touch the Shmuel Juravel because they know the consequences to them in that community.

Who took down Tendler, Gafni and Kolko? Ultimately, their survivors. But who found and organized and supported them? Who gathered and publicized information?

Who publicly exposed them? Who isolated them? Who was responsible for their downfall?

Bloggers get some credit in these cases and clearly had a positive contribution to make.

It appears UOJ contacted the institutions involved, gave them a week to address the allegations and then made it public. As far as I know, that is more than is required by Jewish law in making such allegations public. Particularly, when leaders of these institutions have previously been approached and the immediate danger which according to the allegations exists.

boog said...

http://www.nysun.com/article/35680

Exactly the problem we are up against.

Pandering for Votes.

Make this type of funding and any/all Gov't funding to yeshivas contingent on the mandatory implementation of a Sex registry, Fingerprinting, and DNA sample.

ADMITNOTHING said...

UOJ....You shouls post the names and addresses of the administrators and Schools who harbor these criminals. Through the use of the year end Dinner Journals,it should be very easy to get a lost of names of parents and supporters.

We could then undertake a letter writing campaign to put more pressure on them to do the right thing, if we do the "write" thing.

Lets hit them where it hurts, in the wallet !

Anonymous said...

it, information technology?

uoj is on the money. we need to be less amish, less heimish, and more mathematically literate. after all, ki hi chochmaschem ubinaschem... we must reclaim what is rightfully ours, ibur hachodesh. Without math skills, how can women count? This will lead to moral failure and increase the coefficient of deviancy. Only with computer skills with a hechsher, filters, censorship, project COPE, can the internet save klal yisroel. We must talk to everyone we meet about IT.

After all, if agoodah has a website, how assur can the internet be?

Anonymous said...

"It appears UOJ contacted the institutions involved,"

The details of this are not clear. Were they truly properly warned months ago, or just in veiled threats from an anonymous blog? If someone told you they heard from somebody about what an anonymous blog said about uoj in malaysia, would that constitute fair warning? Did UOJ actually call them or only "someone claiming to be uoj." How credible is that? The fact is that a lawyer's letter would have been ample, legal and the right way to handle this. If this blog was the only warning, it's unfair to expect leaks to be plugged in waterbury etc. because of credibility issues. UOJ knows this and used a crusading attorney to make a public statement in flatbush. But, what about sheftel and shragi? Did they receive the same five star treatment Roshei Yeshiva expect and deserve? If not, uoj owes them an apology. If they were suing him, their lawyers would have used their best stationary and a courier service.

R' Meir Stern said...

Passaic yeshiva doesn't allow yungerleit to take any kind of welfare or government programs. It's demeaning for a ben Tayre to do so. Better to get a parnossa then to shnorr from the public purse.

Shlomo Singer said...

Grubby chassidim vote for left wing Democrats because they favor more free lunches for lazy, unemployed bums. They ignore that left of center Democrat philosophy goes against everything in the Torah.

Yosef Gavriel Bechhofer said...

UOJ = bemakom sheain ish

whyisthisgoingon said...

Who are the leaders of this generation who we can "follow"?

I work with teens from frum homes who have addiction problems and all i see is the "leaders of our community hiding behind the torah." It has distorted the way i look at our leaders. Are they not supposed to be an example for us? Someone Help!!!!

Ira Kukin said...

Now that the school year is over and Margo can no longer pull any retaliatory stunts on parents who speak up, how many parents are sending their sons to another yeshiva next year?

Rabbi Rosenblum said...

July 10th, 2006
Leaflets distributed in several neighborhoods in Jerusalem offered 20,000 shekel to anyone who kills participants in the International Gay Pride Parade scheduled to take place in Jerusalem next month. The flier also suggested that fire bombs be used to kill the participants and gave instructions on how to assemble them.

Anonymous said...

From a marketing perspective, how did uoj get to where he is in blogfame/bloghistory (for his artscroll biography)?

He attracted the attention of a canonical blogger, a weiss knight, and the forward. He more than anyone else succeeded in making Alan Stadtmauer famous (for fifteen minutes), a great accomplishment.

He arranged for thousands of letters to be mailed in Brooklyn.

He arranged a television media event with an attorney.

He was quoted in an expose in NY magazine.

Which of these media methods were most effective, class? If you wanted results, public action and reaction, which would works best or which, in tandem?

A. Print media and advertising?
B. TV?
C. Personal appearances?
D. Blogsphere?
E. All of the Above/None of the Above or any combination with eggroll.

He knows the answer to this question. Just think - if the moetzes knew the answer (and through ruach hakoidesh and daas Toirah we know they do) what might they accomplish for the yeshivois, moisdos, klal Yisroel. The same goes for uoj. If you want results, the preferred method is the way to go. If you want action, you must take action. The information highway waves on air.

Auto Report World Editors said...

Those that choose to blog anonymously, as UOJ does, are trying to tread a very fine line. They are driven by a desire for justice, vengeance or whatever, to speak out on an issue that won't let them be silent. Being real people, with real human connection, they also don't want to be a pariah in the community where they live. Frummies may be infuriating, but most of them, I would like to believe, are sweet people who mean well. Who wants to see people crossing the street to avoid us? Who wants a niece or a nephew to have a problem getting a shidduch caused by their uncle or aunt shooting off their mouth about a powerful, corrupt, rabbi?

Now, personally, I don't give two prutot about what people think about me. I learned early on that I was at best eccentric in most people's eyes. What people think about me, as long as I know the truth, doesn't really matter to me. I can probably describe my flaws better than you can. There's a ma'amar somewhere about never being afraid to admit that you are wrong. I don't like being lied about, but I certainly have enough aveirahs to fill a server full of blogs.

To erliche yidden who seem to get it, all that doesn't matter. They treat all Jews, all of HaShem's creations as well, with respect. They are the Jews who keep this skeptic more or less in the fold. They know the meaning of "there but for the grace of God". They know that every man and woman, including themselves, is capable of monstrous cruelty as well as sublime selflessness. They know that the lo ta'asehs were given to all of us, that a black hat, yichus or even years of true pursuit of Torah is no guarantee against sin.

I was criticized for demanding of Tuvyah an example of his own tshuvah. It's a fair criticism and I understand why the laws of LH apply to one talking about oneself. However, it is Tuvyah and his compatriots who are calling us losers, lowlifes, and heretics. Does Tuvyah want me to do tshuvah, or does Tuvyah relish in schadenfreud as he catalogs the punishments he believes we are earning? What's more important, Jews living according to Torah in peace with each other, or keeping Judaism an exclusive club? Do you want to be a Jew or are you more interested in being a member of FrumClub (tm)?

I am concerned about false accusations - we don't want lives ruined like the Amiraults and McMartins. I also am far more concerned with corrupt leaders and teachers than I am with regular folks who sin. I think all of us will agree that while they are also violations of halacha, a yeshiva rebbe or Bais Yakov teacher getting sexual with a student is a matter of public interest whereas a married frum woman looking for a friend with benefits on Craigslist or a chasid looking to buy a grunt from one of the whores on 7th ave. are private matters, as is some same-sex experimentation by teens.

We want Jerusalem, not Salem.

Note to music fans: I quoted Frank Zappa and Paul Simon lyrics in this post. What are the lyrics and what songs are they from?

Un-Orthodox Jew said...

To get a peek at the mindset of Avi Shafran and the Agudah and the bigots they are, read this killer quote from Shafran on Reform Jews:
>
> "not so much meant to be hated as enemies and wished dead for the
> sake of 'revenge' or to see them dead. The way we hate such people
> is not like the 'cat hates the mouse,' but rather like the
> 'storekeeper hates the vermin' which infest his store, not hating
> the vermin themselves but wanting them gone in order to arrest the
> damage they are causing. We resent their existence. So, in lieu of
> the fact that we are not allowed to physically harm these people
> today, we should still treat them with utter contempt and
> disrespect, avoiding contact with them as one would with any
> destructive fiend."

Un-Orthodox Jew said...

It seems Margulies's fundraising is suffering in Brooklyn, this e-mail is all over the internet!


DEAR BELOVED,

I am Lipa Margulies

PLEASE ENDEAVOUR TO USE IT FOR THE CHILDREN OF GOD. I am
the above named person. I am married to Dr. Aaron Twerski
but I’m now in Nigerian General HOSPITAL taking
treatment for my sickness, who worked with U.S embassy in
LIBERIAN for nine years before he came to my aid in the year 2006.
We were friends for fifty years without a child. He lied
after a brief illness that lasted for only one hour.
Before his death we were both born again assholes. Since
his death I decided not to re-marry or get a child outside
my matrimonial home which the Bible is against.

When my late wife was alive she deposited the sum
of$10.5 Million (Ten Million five hundred thousand
U.S.Dollars) with A Bank Presently, this money is still
under the safe keeping of the Reserve FINANCE COMPANY
Recently, my Doctor told me that I would not last for the
next SEVEN months due to my molester coverup problems.

Though what disturbs me most is my getting caught.Having known my
condition, I decided to donate this fund to church or
better still a Christian or muslim individual That will
utilize this money the way I am going to instruct here in.
I want a church that will use this fund on, orphanages,
deaf and domb and poor widows propagating the word of God
and to ensure that the house of God is maintained. The
Bible made us to understand that blessed is the hand that
giveth. I took this decision because I don't have any
child that will inherit this money and my husband
relatives are not Christians and I don't want my husband's
hard earned money to be misused by unbelievers. I don't
want a situation where this money will be used in an
ungodly manner. Hence the reason for taking this bold
decision.

I am not afraid of death hence I know where I am going right to Hell. I
know that I am going to be in the ass of the Lord.
Exodus 14 VS 14 says that the lord will fight my case and
I shall hold my "piece." I don't need any telephone
communication in this regard because of my health because
of the presence of my husband's relatives around me
always. I don't want them to know about this development.
With God all things are possible. As soon as I receive
your reply I forward your personal information, such as
Your full name, Your full address, with Your telephone and
fax number to my lawyer so that he will contact you as the
legal owner of my fund before the bank will be
transferring the fund into your nominated Bank Account in
your country.

I will also issue you a letter of a authority that will
back you up as the real next of kin and the original-
beneficiary of my fund. I want you and the church to
always pray for me because the lord is my shepherd,you
will also promise me that you will not seat on the fund
when it gets into your bank account. My happiness is that
I lived a life of a worthy prick. Whoever that wants
to serve the Lord must serve him in spirit and truth.
Please always be prayerful all through your life, any
delay in your reply will give me room in serching for a
church or Christian individual for this same purpose.
Please assure me that you will act accordingly as I stated
herein. Hoping to hear from you as soon as possible.

Remain blessed in the name of the Lord.

Yours in Christ,

Lipa Margulies

challenge to the Jewish Men said...

To all UOJ bloggers. I am an obsevant woman and I am challenging the men on this board to start a registry . NOW! We need a solution. Right now UOJ is the only one taking down the schools who are harboring pedophiles.

I see you cheering him on, but I don't see any of you taking on the work load, or helping establish a business man's registry. Money talks. We need successful men who feel like UOJ to start this registry. YOu can anonmously hire someone to run it. (remember Charlie from "Charies Angels" you never saw him but he made it all happen.

You successful buisiness men, get together and make a real registry happen.

This is too much for one man. UOJ will get burn out and then what will you do???? Go for the golden calf????

Please, I urge you. All winning teams have a great foundation. Build the foundation. Start now.

We know wht the problem is...Please somebody besides Elliot Passik , (who will not go against the Rabbinate) start a real registry for all Klal.

Will you start this?

Somebody needs to help UOJ. It is too much for one man.

May hashem guide you that you find it in your heart to take the action and not just think a bout it.
Do something !!!!

Who is a real man?????

Anonymous said...

I personally called Applegrad at Torah Temimah and he admitted to me that he had been warned by phone (before the letters were mailed), but that he would never respond to an anonymous person. He told me that if the person would give him his name, he would then be able to talk to him.

Anonymous said...

u really showed 'em who u r, uo.

this is it, kids. He said he's been dropping hints everywhere. This is a big one.

uoj is nigerian.

UOJ is a hypocrite said...

WOW - you're an even bigger hypocrite than I thought - you criticize Shafran for taking a hard line on the reform after the shameful things you wrote (also taking a hard line worthy of the entire moetzes) about jews (not accused of any crime or abuse) struggling with their homosexuality last year?

You are just as big a bigot as the aguda is - I'm amused that you're also a much bigger hypocrite since you can attack them for essentially the same traditionalist position you have.

You continue to show how you have zero integrity - you can't both be a slave to tradition and an outsider criticizing in. Make up your mind, waffler.

I'm sure you wont post this, since any legit attack gets silenced on this farshtunkeneh website.

Chaifetz Chashud said...

Can someone recap the problems in Waterbury? I was seriously thinking of sending my son there at one point. What's the deal? Are they a front for the Conn. division of Nambla?

Anonymous said...

If YTT would offer avi shafran more money, would he take the job as their publicist?

not enuf kavod.

But, what if they offered him a free custom sheitel?

Burnt by Daas Torah said...

It seems Margulies's fundraising is suffering in Brooklyn, this e-mail is all over the internet!


DEAR BELOVED,

I am Lipa Margulies...etc....
___________________________________________

Why do you post such idiotic nonsense? I do believe that we are discussing a very serious problem, so why joke around so distastefully? We cannot expect our "Daas Torah" to help, that I know for sure. As far as I am concerned there is NO Daas Torah. I know that my life has been adversely affected by the so called Daas Torah, and I really feel there is NO ONE we can trust to help us in really important personal issues.

Anonymous said...

To get a peek at the mindset of unorthodox jew and the bigot he is, read this killer quote from UOJ on gays:

Homosexual behavior, which is not the same as Homosexuals(there are none),is a sin against civilization(as well as God's intent for mankind).
The Gay agenda is out to destroy the family, if that's not a nail in the coffin of civilization, you are a lost soul who is either not smart or just a naive putz.


I'm not sure I see the difference between attacking reform jews for championing reform causes and attacking gays for supporting gay causes. But perspective is something you've always lacked, fool.

Anonymous said...

but what about the enrollment at ytt, uo?

If not now, when


can we move into our new luxury condo?

Anonymous said...

The real problem is Lashon Hara and choshed bekesheirim. We are facing way bigger problems don't you think Hashem knows what happened and who is right? don't you think he is being patient and giving us hints and warnings? OPEN YOR EYES!!!!

And I mean the children that are victemized. They are afraid to speak up / badly because no one will listen to them. But Hashem hears their cries.

We are facing very scary times if we don't shape up soon. Don't you hear the thunder and lightening!!!

No one wants to take the time to fond out the truth unless they can publish it in a magzine and get paid.

How about whispering some prayers for peace?

Remember when you had a problem with one of your pears and you tried to seek help from a Rebbe or Morah as a child ahd they said I don't want to hear it's Lashon Hara? well when a child is "Labled" no teacher has a problem beleiving that Loshon Harah and destroying all the kids chances at a future. These are children you are talking about.

Some parents have died trying to fend for their children. By believing the negative reports on innocent children.

The mind is a powerful tool propoganda made the Church a lot of MONEY BUT DID NOT HELP THE JEWS IN ANY WAY!!!!

Anonymous said...

Tehilim for peace and the POW in Gaza.

#18
#92
#122
#139

Lets pray for Jubilee all thos in captive to be set free and our land to be returned this year perpretrator and enemy free.

Anonymous said...

At least he did not convince you that you were gay, we had to take my brother out because he was getting turned on by it and they actuallly had him convinced that he was gay. Thank G-D he told me and I was able to persuade him by telling him he is not gay he is jus in experienced and put him in a mixed school with girls till he found one he thought was not so disgusting or "Tameh"

ignored in waterbury said...

UOJ,
Are we going to hear tonight of waterburys situation? or is it tomorrow 12 am?

willing to help out uoj said...

I agree with you that we need to start a registy to help out uoj.
Here is the problem.
Untill there is one korban(sacrifice) made , meaning at least one major yeshiva is taken down by UOJ (to the ground) ,people are still scared to help out for fear of revenge from the konoyim.
Once the thugs see that we are a serious bunch hopefully they will back off.

Anonymous said...

Hey, Challenge to the Jewish Men -

Passik "will not go against the rabbinate"? You got him wrong. He's gone everywhere. Rabbis, Jewish and Catholic organizations, mainstream, dissidents, and this blog, by the way, by his actual name, one of the tiny few. Do you read the Jewish Week? Do you know that he just got the NY background check bill passed?

He's not stopping at that either, he wants the registry too, but that needs to be our own internal requirement. How do you form a registry unless you get the cooperation of 700 yeshivas and thousands of rabbis in the United States? The klal has to work together.

BTW, he's somewhat amused by all of this, given the circumstances. I recall that one of his first posts was simply to try to organize a parlor meeting or forum on this issue, and he would speak. Not one invitation yet, from anybody here or elsewhere. So observant woman, check your own hat.

I know, I'm in his mid-to-outer circle. Good guy.

Anonymous said...

Is uoj compassionate towards Jews struggling with their homosexuality? Is he compassionate towards those struggling with their heterosexuality? Is God?

Scandal isn't new in the Jewish community. Less than perfect people have gotten women pregnant, cheated on their wives, had affairs, men and women, and done bad things. People steal. They lie. They cheat. The fact that they struggle with their lack of integrity is to their credit, but at the end of the day, how different is the ganev who cheats and the rotzeach who lusts to kill from those struggling with homosexuality who love? Is there really a difference between any of these cases? Each one is programmed a certain way, given choices and commanded to be good. The moetzes doesn't issue commands to be good. They and uoj did not make up the tradition. UOJ's methods lack a certain finesse if he didn't give written notice of his intentions, outside this blog. Did he imagine that all the roshei yeshiva sit around each day following his blog? So and so many hits, it must be so? This was irresponsible, UO. Maybe you think outing Rabbi alan stadtmauer and Rav Moshe Eisemann was a mitzvah, but is it really?

You'll argue that you saved and are saving more victims, that you don't expect or need another plaque. You'll bawl in private, proud of everything you've done, but when the means aren't 100% kosher, is this the Jewish way? If someone called with an anonymous stock tip, would you buy or sell? Wouldn't you want something on paper, at least to show others to justify your actions? You will be called to account for what you are doing, and you may be Gd's little angel, but I think shraggi, sheftel, Isaac, Yanky, Ezra and their children, Rabbi Ruderman's family, and Rav Naftali Neuberger, zecher tzaddik livrocho, might just have a case against you if they are feeling betrayed. You are hurting them. Why couldn't your P.I. contact them? banim lo aymun bum.

Anonymous said...

uoj is a hypocrite, waffler,

UOJ assumes the worst and is, therefore, protecting future victims from the worst. By using christological references to show disgust, he demonstrates that he is not a true traditionalist. A traditionalist with agoodah views would never say such a thing. es passst nisht.

Uoj's identity is a riddle. He's flamed up the griddle. He's bigoted, yes, like many others, a pancake, not a waffle.

Anonymous said...

Supporting gay causes is no mitzvah. Reform Judaism includes gays and gay synagogues. Ergo, if uoj supports tolerance for Reform Jews, he tolerates gays too, so long as they don't molest his children and his neighbors' children and tinoikois shel bais rabban. He has established a higher level of accountability from rabbis whose weakness is homosexual urges. If you are not a rabbi, he loves you.

Anonymous said...

URGENT REMINDER!!!!!!

Today 7-11-06 is the date of the Gerrer F--kfest in honor of the super pervert A.M. Leizerowitz who has been representative of all that ger stands for. In the event of a change in venue please contact any Gerrorist

Challenge to the Jewish Men said...

Where are the Jewish men to help UOJ?????? Where are you?????

I see criticism, I see some supportive posts. Put your money where your posts are.

Where is the solution??????

Anonymous said...

Anonymous said...
I personally called Applegrad at Torah Temimah and he admitted to me that he had been warned by phone (before the letters were mailed), but that he would never respond to an anonymous person. He told me that if the person would give him his name, he would then be able to talk to him.
-------------------------------
Tell Mr. Appleface that it would be alot easier to deal with an anonymous blogger then an annonymous FBI AGENT.

Shteg said...

PM sharon of cursed memory tried to launder money for his new phoney party--kadima through a Hungarian Yeshiva in Brooklyn called Spinka. I wasn't very surprised to learn of this because I had the misfortune to attend that Yeshiva as a youth and am intimately familiar with Rubin, Weiss and the rest of those Hungarian crooks.

Today a Judge in Israel sentenced 2 men to laughable sentences. 1 year probation and a 50,000 shekel fine.

http://hydepark.hevre.co.il/topic.asp?topic_id=1981139

OrthoRev said...

To the chagrin and severe disappointment of my detractors…..some insights.

First, just to quickly dispel the wacko (and truly insane) ‘toilet for brains’ anon above..

Although you have fallen pray to the gay agenda it does not change the fact that people are NOT born gay.

The reason some males are attracted to other males is that, during childhood, they did not receive the proper self-esteem to actualize into an adult male and now view themselves as ‘inferior men’ or women- hence being attracted to other males.

Therefore, supporting ‘gay rights’ is support for normalizing an illness-- as opposed to identifying the illness and trying to cure it.

It is akin to saying “well, let’s just give everyone aids since then the people that do have aids will feel better (as opposed to the normal rational thought of simply working for a cure).

Now..on to bigger and better…

Was on vacation ("vacay" to the cool 'frum' in Brooklyn)- and noticed several things.

The further you get from Brooklyn (especially overseas)…..

1. The shorter the sheitals are…

2. The smaller the diamonds worn by the 18-21 year-old crowd are…

3. Less people are wearing bullet-proof super-black concrete stockings…

4. The people are more sincere..

5. Nicer...

6. Less Neurotic..

7. Less heads are spontaneously detached from bodies due to severe shuckling (and less herniated discs are found due to severe chronic bowing right through the floor-to the basement- during Mo’dim)…

8. More people are davening normally, calmly and…..sincerely…

9. Parents don’t whine to their kids about how they don’t have enough derech eretz and kovod for them….

10. AND.. the chasidim don't stink as badly.

In browsing some of the latest UOJ comments…. I have come to appreciate the utter brilliance, undeniable wisdom, pure genius and sheer glory behind the age old saying of...

Frum Is a Mental Disorder.

One 'Frum' actually wrote (no, I am not making this up- go back and check) that since Eisemann learned ‘good’ torah and wrote ‘nice’ seforim, the perpetrated anal rape is not such a big deal and "he should be dismissed with dignity" !?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?

This. Is. The. Craziest. Thing. I. Have. Ever. Heard.

Once again, I will have to write the letter that Ner Yisroel should have wrote (and, the only thing that can logically be said in such a situation):

Dear all:

We are deeply sadden by the news that one of our entrusted Ra’baim has been involved in harming young innocent talmidim and exposing them to tremendous pain, suffering and trauma. Whatever efforts were lacking in the past, we have realized the wrong and are deeply sorry and regretful. We would like to take this opportunity to express in a clear loud voice that we will do everything to help the victims and ease their pain. While we acknowledge that the accused has done some good in his career at Ner Yisroel, it is only fair, right and just that our focus be on the pain of the victims and not on the contributions of the victimizer.

May hashem send a R’efua Sh’lamiah to the innocent victims as well as to the R’ Eisemann.

Sincerely,
Ner Yisroel.

Of course, we will not get this but instead we get the usual racket as expected: Mongering ‘rebbe- beard slapping’ ‘round-up the wagons’ ‘put the ear plugs in’ and defend, deny, twist, manipulate, (as a good jew always should- doesn’t it say in the Torah that Yackov ‘tricked/manipulated’ Eisav!!) fight the Hamon Am, attack the victims, and whatever you do never apologize.

Frum Is A Mental Disorder.

www.FrumIsAMentalDisorder.com

I remain, OrthoRev

Anonymous said...

Mandatory fingerprinting is a no-brainer.PARENTS WHERE ARE YOU?DEMAND FROM YOUR YESHIVAS THAT IF THEY DON'T FALL IN LINE WITH MANDATORY fingerprINTING YOU'LL PULL YOUR KID(S)OUT.
UOJ!
PRINT A LIST OF YESHIVAS THAT
MANDATE FP AND WATCH EVERYBODY ELSE COMPLY.

Anonymous said...

N.Y. Sun, July 11, 2006, page 4:

New York Desk

Albany

Bill Passed To Allow Checks On Religious School Employees

State lawmakers passed a bill that will allow independent and religious schools to conduct federal background checks on prospective employees. Through the FBI's national criminal background check system, employers will be able to learn if a job candidate has ever been convicted of a crime, anywhere in the nation. The bill, which is sponsored by a state senator, Dean Skelos, of Long Island, and Assembly Member Harvey Weisenberg of Long Island, is awaiting the approval of Governor Pataki. About 500,000 students attend nonpublic schools across the state.

Irving Langer said...

"Applegrad at Torah Temimah and he admitted to me that he had been warned by phone (before the letters were mailed), but that he would never respond to an anonymous person."

Did Applegrad keep Kolko's identity anonymous when he got a summer rental for him at Regency?

Anonymous said...

"it" is being gay?

"it" is being genaivish?

it is a game? tag, you're it?

big ot it?

Anonymous said...

uoj protects widows and orphans, the homeless, the hungry, the tired, the poor, and the abused.

he does not protect abusers or their enablers. He outs them out, a rough rider (ruff, ruff) and throws them away into the pit (that's it).

WIth the rage of his generation, is he James Dean?

boog said...

Self-policing will not work and You're p--sing into the wind if you think that yeshivas are going to set up a Registry at parents request. HO-HO-HO!

You need the current law beefed up with mandatory compliance or there will be levied severe financial penalties, loss of accreditation as I outlined previously, with State/City requirements for filing at least once a year and every time there is a new hire. No exceptions/no loopholes.

You're dealing with low-life gangsters who have and will continue to run rings around the parent body. They only understand and respect the language of force.

They need the strong hand of Big Brother to hold them by the scruff of their necks and force compliance.

The venue for change is the NYS Legislature. The target is Shelly (Take a walk with me in the Park, break your leg and I'll get you the Big Bucks--Weitz & Luxembourg Silver).

Anonymous said...

Im glad to see rabbi Fuerst is starting to get his

George Karfunkel said...

Has Ner Yisroel Baltimore had any reaction, official or unofficial, to the eruption here?

Anonymous said...

Re: Registry and all other ideas:

E-mail me at bes1267@yahoo.com

I have stood up to the powers that be before - I posted about my experience with Torah Temimah.

Please contact me, but I need real names for it to work.

Thanks,

Eli Greenwald

Challenge to Jewish Men said...

UOJ can not bring a yeshiva who is harboring a pedophile to the ground by himself. Yes, embarassment, yes, make them flee to Israel to perhaps again hurt more children.....but we need brave souls NOW to start a registry. NOW!!! The combination of a registry and UOJ...then we are talking some serious bringing down of Yeshivas who are not protecting our children.

We just need one willing established frum Business man to make a start. Who is willing to be a mediator between UOJ the regisrtry, and the attorneys that will write up the by laws?

If you are that courageous established, caring, want to make a difference in the world, man. Then email UOJ. He respons to all the emails. He responds to my emails all the time.


Please. Let's not wait. Let's start our new leadership.

Imagine, a registry where each teacher or Rabbi coming in to a Yeshiva is checked out thoroughly and the registry will be so lucrative that it won't worry about clsoing it's ears or eyes to whisperings of previous assaults on children!

Can't you see it? I can! A new safe Klal!

Jewish men where are you???????

Is UOJ the only true real man on this blog?????

A real man protects women and children, and will go to any length to ensure their safety.


Please, Jewish men come foward. Email UOJ. Business Men, send a proposal for a registry.....Doctors, join in.....come on.....Where are you????

Auto Report World Editors said...

Another one of UOJ's anonymous critics said:

To get a peek at the mindset of unorthodox jew and the bigot he is, read this killer quote from UOJ on gays:

Homosexual behavior, which is not the same as Homosexuals(there are none),is a sin against civilization(as well as God's intent for mankind).
The Gay agenda is out to destroy the family, if that's not a nail in the coffin of civilization, you are a lost soul who is either not smart or just a naive putz.


I see nothing bigoted here, though I disagree with UOJ about the existence of homosexuals. A small percentage of humans seem to be naturally attracted to their own sex. That notwithstanding, only someone who agrees with it would deny that there is a gay agenda. Stanley Kurtz of National Review Online has written extensively on how the gay marriage issue is a stalking horse for those who want to destroy the institution of marriage, or extend it to include polyamorists and other groupings so as to make marriage meaningless.

This is the second time you have alleged that UOJ is a racist or a bigot, both times with no real evidence. The "racism" charge was based on the fact the UOJ quoted the Rambam as expressing less than modern views on ethnicity and race. Should Huckleberry Finn be banned because of "Nigger Jim"?

I'm a bit perplexed, though, why you are so concerned with UOJ's alleged opinions on race, sexuality and heterodox Jews and their movements. You are trying to sound like a liberal, but why would a liberal Jew oppose UOJ, who is going after some of orthodoxy's sacred cows?

No, I think you are just another Tuvya-like-frummie. You think that UOJ is supported by lowlifes, losers, Modern Orthdodox and even worse, chas v'shalom, Reform and Conservative Jews. You don't understand that Boog and Gross and Orthorev and others who post here do so because they love Torah and can't stomach how it has been perverted, not because they want to go off the derech and abandon Judaism.

We're also not idiots. We read your quotes from the UOJ archives and scratch our heads wondering, is this the best you can do? Charah, you should be drummed out of the club, most frummies can do a much better job of character assasination than a vague quote representative of 99% of American social conservatives.

Anonymous said...

My response to Gross:

If an entire society does not worry about the "spirit" of the law in taking government money, it is a very high standard to ask people to care about the spirit. You are basically telling people to have less rights to government money than the rest of american society. I agree it is a very beautiful thing to worry about the spirit, but i certainly will not criticize those who follow the letter without worrying about the spirit...so long as there's no fraud involved. I hope your not an accountant...as the more legal loopholes the better the accountant. Maybe you, Gross, are an angel, but more likely you just aren't in a situation to take advantage of legal loopholes. Look at yourself in the mirror and tell me you wouldn't take advantage of a completely legal loophole that you felt wasn't in the "spirit" of the law. If you can say that than we have finally found ourselves a real gadol hador.

Anonymous said...

The bill passed "will allow fingerprinting." Was fingerprinting forbidden before the bill was passed? Is this some sort of joke?
Mr. Skelos, please pass a bill that will "allow" "mashed potatoes" given at lunch.
WTF, unbelievable bullshit!

Time to educate our rabbis said...

Rabbi Avi Shafran took the first step by admitting that there's a problem. Perhaps he will take the second step enroll in The Awareness Center's certification program for rabbis. Wouldn't it be amazing if he became on of their financial sponsors and advocated that all rabbis go through their program?

Anonymous said...

uo, don't you think you should have sent a letter to sheftel and shragi? If not a lawyer's letter, then at least something like serial killers have the courtesy to do, cutting out the letters from newspapers or newsweek magazine? Then, if they brought in Rabbi Tendler or the fbi to trace the paper for fingerprints and your identity, at least they'd have had a fair, fighting chance to do the right thing. Now, they're in blotte and probably hate you. Don't you think waterbury deserves a chance? You've issued an ultimatum not unlike that given to Pharoah's firstborn. You are striking at midnight or midday, whatever. If the ribbono shel olam wanted all these people dead, immediately, He would strike them down. In most cases, He gives everyone a long rope. Why must the hangman be in such a hurry? Don't botch your executions or that's the it people will be talking about.

Anonymous said...

Feurst should be tossed out on his fat hairy butt.
He covered up for too many trouble makers.

Anonymous said...

As a judge of character you must understand that the plaintive voice speaks in pain. The poster you refer to is obviously struggling and would like some compassion. In the frum community, it's all or nothing. You're either in, a tzaddik, or out, a rasha. The Orthogay agenda is to have your cake (sic) and eat it too. This is not the divine plan. They can wish it, try to force change, rebel, do their own thing and then expect validation, or we can talk about it, but talking about it doesn't make much difference.

It's a great divide, but do most people think outing people on the internet is derech hayashar?

Un-Orthodox Jew said...

Bruchim haboim R'Orthorev,

Speaking on behalf of the Jewish Blogosphere, we really missed you. Before you vacay, please prepare us emotionally; we all suffered from withdrawal, especially me.
I needed those doses of frank, emesdige reminders of the kaka we're in.

Welcome home!

Anonymous said...

uoj , any news on waterbury? 12 am has passed

Baruch M'schaye Maysim said...

Orthorev. Your letter that we will never see from Ner Yisroel is so brilliant in its simplicity and sincerity.

Can anybody actually EXPLAIN the frum mental disorder that does not allow for this kind of thing?
Why must we wait for Mashiach ben Dovid AND ben Yosef for a yeshiva to ever admit a mistake? Am I the only one who doesn't understand this?

Anonymous said...

"I will have to write the letter that Ner Yisroel should have wrote"

yes, welcome back ortho rev! I miss your goodly use of english

ADMITNOTHING said...

ANONYMUS WROTE: uo, don't you think you should have sent a letter to sheftel and shragi? If not a lawyer's letter, then at least something like serial killers have the courtesy to do, cutting out the letters from newspapers or newsweek magazine? Then, if they brought in Rabbi Tendler or the fbi to trace the paper for fingerprints and your identity, at least they'd have had a fair, fighting chance to do the right thing. Now, they're in blotte and probably hate you. Don't you think waterbury deserves a chance? You've issued an ultimatum not unlike that given to Pharoah's firstborn. You are striking at midnight or midday, whatever. If the ribbono shel olam wanted all these people dead, immediately, He would strike them down. In most cases, He gives everyone a long rope. Why must the hangman be in such a hurry? Don't botch your executions or that's the it people will be talking about.

WHAT A CRPCK OF SHIT. GIVE THEM A CHANCE FOR WHAT ???? THESE YESHIVAHS ENABLED THESE CRIMINAL PEDOHILE CHILD MOLESTERS TO HURT OUR CHILDREN.

IMO, WE SHOULD OUT THEM ALL AT ONCE . GIVE NO CHANCES...TAKE NO PRISONERS !

THESE ARE SICK PERVERTED PEOPLE WHO HAVE BEEN HIDING BEHIND THE TORAH, PREYING ON YOUNG CHILDREN AND MESSING UP COUNTLESS LIVES.

Moshe Gottesman said...

Surely there has to be someone here from Baltimore who heard a comment or two from the Neuberger clan. Please share what they had to say.

Anonymous said...

Ortho,

Welcome back - Did you vacation on Mars?

gross said...

My response to Gross:

If an entire society does not worry about the "spirit" of the law in taking government money, it is a very high standard to ask people to care about the spirit. You are basically telling people to have less rights to government money than the rest of american society. I agree it is a very beautiful thing to worry about the spirit, but i certainly will not criticize those who follow the letter without worrying about the spirit...so long as there's no fraud involved. I hope your not an accountant...as the more legal loopholes the better the accountant. Maybe you, Gross, are an angel, but more likely you just aren't in a situation to take advantage of legal loopholes. Look at yourself in the mirror and tell me you wouldn't take advantage of a completely legal loophole that you felt wasn't in the "spirit" of the law. If you can say that than we have finally found ourselves a real gadol hador.


"Completely legal loophole"..."entire society"... What are you talking about? Deliberate misrepresentation in such an instance is probably not even legal because the couple might still be considered married - even with just a religious ceremony - for these purposes. The reason they receive benefits is probably because they don't inform the government of their religious ceremony. Sounds like fraud to me. According to you there is nothing wrong with Chassidim not holding themselves to a higher standard than shvartzes. Choosing not to obtain a HS diploma so that one may receive welfare (premediated!) is, in my opinion behavior that is lower than low. Even a shvartze in the South Bronx wouldn't do that.

It's no mitzvah not to get a job and be a normal part of society. That's the underlying issue being ignored!

Anonymous said...

Theories about what causes unnatural urges are unproven. Biology, psychology, psychobabble, blah, blah, blah. What difference does it make if someone feels compelled and chooses to be a murderer, an ochel tarfus, boelay arayos, knocking the gedoilay hadoir, yes, the gedoilim, the roshei yeshiva, who know more than any others what gedoilim they really are. Pass the chulent.

The Neuberger clan are lawyer's lawyers, rabbi's rabbi's, a rosh kollel, roshei yeshiva. They have vested interests to protect. Fyi, this is what operation protect is all about.

Anonymous said...

I live in Baltimore, they are devising a spin scenario as we speak.

Parent said...

I have a kid in Baltimore.
( I'm taking him out)
I called Sheftel 10 days before Uoj went public. I told him I was Uoj. He said he was surprised to hear this about Eiseman, but would look into it. My friend called him and told him again about Eiseman 3 days later, he said this is the first time someone called about Eiseman.
I had another friend call 2 days after that, Sheftel said this is the FIRST time he's hearing about Eiseman and will look into it. I think you get the point, they are liars from the top to the bottom.

Anonymous said...

who's on first?

I don't know is on second.

what's his name? is on third?

this is the first time i've heard about this is a good line. Let us learn from the roshei yeshiva. Let us be inspired by toyreh lishma. Let us give until it hurts.

nirc graduate said...

Anonymous said...
uo, don't you think you should have sent a letter to sheftel and shragi? If not a lawyer's letter, then at least something like serial killers have the courtesy to do, cutting out the letters from newspapers or newsweek magazine? Then, if they brought in Rabbi Tendler or the fbi to trace the paper for fingerprints and your identity, at least they'd have had a fair, fighting chance to do the right thing. Now, they're in blotte and probably hate you. Don't you think waterbury deserves a chance? You've issued an ultimatum not unlike that given to Pharoah's firstborn. You are striking at midnight or midday, whatever. If the ribbono shel olam wanted all these people dead, immediately, He would strike them down. In most cases, He gives everyone a long rope. Why must the hangman be in such a hurry? Don't botch your executions or that's the it people will be talking about.
=================================
One question for you.
If rabbi Eismann came into your home at night , tied you up and proceeded to RAPE YOUR DAUGHTERS AND WIFE.
Would you give this whole pshetil about paroh and coutesy for srial killers?
Think about it for less than a second please

Anonymous said...

They are smarter than everybody. They drink Gaiva of the mount wilson plain.

Anonymous said...

Dear UOJ,

I had Rabbi Moshe Eisemann as a rebbe in high school in the Yeshiva of Philadelphia about... years ago. He was from England and spoke the King’s English impeccably which made him sound very wise and learned to us at the time.

He convinced me that my lack of hasmada and enthusiasm for learning Torah had everything to do with my auto-erotic behavior, in which he expressed great deal of interest; how did I do it?, how frequently?, etc.

He never physically molested me but he made me feel that my normal adolescent attraction towards girls was something to be ashamed of. It took me a long time to finally realize that these urges were perfectly normal and given to us by G-d for a good reason.

I always wondered why he left the Yeshiva of Philadelphia to go to Baltimore. You might want to go back and see if the cover-up of Rabbi Eisemann’s behavior began even before he came to Ner Israel.

Keep up your good and holy work.

Anonymous said...

You can't convict on the basis of innuendo. maybe this, maybe that. Ask reb shmuel. He would know. He knows these problems exist. They're human.

If you've read reb tzadok, take a look at shomer habris, a mystical treatise devoted to this subject, hot. Maybe the Rebbe was after tikkun oilom?

boog said...

Hey Ortho;

I was beginning to think your absence was self-inflicted and permanent because it didn't look as if UOJ was staking you to your own radio show.

Good to have you back! So maybe you shouldn't make like Andy Warhol, already.

Keep hocking!

Anonymous said...

Dishonesty in the approach and tactics of the hanhala at NIRC is not new. The Mechina, especially. Gaiva of the farm runs that show.

Ner l'ragli, misabek b'afar raglehem. Do they clean their socks?

They have profited from contacts in south america, iran, and loyal alumni (who?).

UOJ, klal yisroel awaits YOUR yeshiva. Your blog will grow l'hagdil Toira ulhaadira.

OrthoRev said...

Thank you UOJ for your kind words of welcome- it is much appreciated.

To address the posed question re: What is the 'mental disorder" behind "Frum Is A Mental Disorder”?

While the answer is not severely complicated it will take several posts and discussions to elucidate clearly in a manner that will allow for the explanation be fully grasped in its entirety. However, to explain very briefly:

Yeshivas today do NOT (in any way) teach Judaism.

They DO teach an adulterated form of a ‘religion’ that ostensibly in some ways resembles portions of Judaism.

This ‘religion’ preaches that God is an evil ogre-devil who delights in torture and punishments.

This training starts very early and gets continually worse as one progresses through the yeshiva ‘system’.

Initially, very young seven/eight year olds are taught that they must daven and learn and do mitzvos etc. in order to avoid not 'getting an averiah'— since such averiah would cause the wrath of God to descend upon them and their children for generations to come.

While this teaching continues in various forms throughout one's yeshiva education. The pre-eminent display of this NON-Judaism undoubtedly occurs in high school.

Yeshiva High School dedicates 50% of hebrew studies expounding upon the severe evils of masturbation and the fiery diseases and devastating consequences (blindness, no kids, kids without arms, death etc.) that God is eagerly seeking to place upon the vile pieces of dirt who commit this sin.

All of the above replaces the education and molding of young students into happy, independent and self-actualized adults.

The god-given teenage zest for life are their energy and eagerness to develop, mature, grow and refine their personalities and life-concepts are sucked out by 'rabeim' on meaningless, empty, destructive and worthless ranting and raving.

This does not only take the form of thrice daily ‘masturbation shmoozes’ but it is also seen in the very ill and disturbing behavior of teaching ‘Sha’ar Ha’gavieh’ and “Controlling Ka’as” (??) in M’esilas Ye’sahrim instead of nurturing children and helping them with their plurality of questions, concerns, issues etc.

There is so VERY VERY much to say on this topic… however, writing and clearly illuminating the severe ills and distributing mental behavior of our so-called religion, leaders and education system is so emotionally draining….more to come…..

I still remain, OrthoRev.

www.FrumIsAMentalDisorder.com

Anonymous said...

Spirit of the Law:

Read Rav Hirsch and you will be enlightened.

The Spirit of the Law is the Law to a large degree. Of course, we must keep the Law for without the structure of the law, we have nothing. This is what the Christians did. But many Mitzvos have symbolic meaning - lulov, estrog, etc. there is a spirit that they represent. While you are certainly yotzei the mitzva of lulov if you shake the lulov without understanding the representation, if you do understand the symbolic meaning your reward is that much greater.

What I am driving at is that you are perverting the Torah. Your claim that the spirit is an extra when, in fact, it is a fundamental shows a basic lack of understanding of simple Yahadus on your part.

No, it doesn't make you an angel to keep the basics. In fact, there was a time in the not too distant past when these things were understood by the average, simple yid. Somewhere along the way we have lost our way. The ordinary has now become heroic. How unforunate!

Anonymous said...

Contributions to uoj's yeshiva will also benefit orthorev's radio ministry.

Ortho, your spiel might play well across america as you document for DSM V how born agains and frum are both new mental disorders.

You'll attract a greater following.

Un-Orthodox Jew said...

Anon requesting to ask R'Shmuel Kaminetsky why Eiseman left Philadelphia:

Is this the same R' Shmuel K. that said about Kolko;"if there are no new allegations of Kolko's abusing kids in the last FEW MONTHS, we must assume Kolko did tshuva."?????

IS IT? DO YOU EXPECT HIM TO SAY ANYTHING THAT WE CAN RELY ON?

His son in-law is Tzvi Berkowitz of Baltimore who said to a victim of Eiseman " DON'T SAY ANYTHING TO ANYONE, IT WILL HURT THE YESHIVA!"

Do you think Berkowitz didn't discuss this with his father in-law?

IS THE ENTIRE JEWISH WORLD ON MIND-DISTORTING DRUGS????????

Anonymous said...

orthoreverend, revolutionary, reactionary, revulsed by kaka,

"Yeshiva High School dedicates 50% of hebrew studies expounding upon the severe evils of masturbation and the fiery diseases and devastating consequences (blindness, no kids, kids without arms, death etc.) that God is eagerly seeking to place upon the vile pieces of dirt who commit this sin." The fact is that I only heard a rebbe speak against hashchosas zera once and at the end of the year. I was surprised that he even mentioned it. Nobody else talked about it, hush hush, the great no know. My friends never talked about it either. I guess because they didn't know about the takkana alluded to previously, that they weren't supposed to. The reality is it's a private matter.

Maybe in chassidishe moisdois, where shoimer habris is taken seriously, they do. I suspect they don't there also. Who does? Your facts are wrong, orth, and if we can't trust your opinion on basics, how can we trust your diagnosis? I want a second opinion.

Anonymous said...

reb shmuel has told men who have admitted they have gay tendencies not to tell their wives. Does this make him a rosho or a tzaddik? The men don't act on their desires, stay married, have bonim zechorim to send to yeshivois, and happy ever after.

reb shmuel knows these problems exist and that not everyone who has gay thoughts is evil. He bases himself on the assumption that a talmud chochom like uoj does teshuva every day. True?

I cannot speak for reb tzvee. I can't say anything to anyone. It will hurt the yeshiva.
my new mantra.

of course, in laws speak.

after the zeman at camp achim or camp agudah.

Auto Report World Editors said...

Gross,

Regarding government rules, fraud and religious marriages. Years ago I was asked by my ex's OB-GYN to see if I could find an orthodox rabbi in another town who was willing to perform a marriage ceremony for his elderly mother and her boyfriend. Both survived spouses who had died, met each other and fell in love. If they became civilly married they would lose some of their combined Social Security benefits - which on fixed incomes meant they could not afford to be married in the eyes of the federal government. They also did not want to live together or have sex without the sanction of a kosher Jewish wedding ceremony. I happened to have a friend with smicha who lived in that town, he was tickled by the opportunity to be m'sader kidushin and the chasuna went off without a hitch. It must have been a nice ceremony, he's a professional musician - some of you may have his albums.

So where's the crime? Where's the fraud? Couples shack up all the time and the gov't doesn't consider them to be married for the purposes of Social Security benefits. I suppose it's the difference between tax avoidance which is legal and tax evasion which is not. As long as all the rules are followed, it's legal.

I've never been a fan of the welfare state and I'm a capitalist from the word go, but if your most marketable skills is taking public assistance, that's the rational thing to do in the short term. Yes, it's appalling that there are Jews who consider taking public assistance a normative lifestyle. It's even more appalling that they there are Jews who think that taking welfare is preferable to learning a more valuable marketable skill (yeah, right, like these particular chareidim want these girls to be anything other than baby factories - just thought of another reason why they let them drop out, so they can get a year's head start on popping out the kinderlach). And no doubt there are frummies that defend it saying, "Look at all the shvartzes and PRs who take welfare!" (ignoring the fact that most welfare recipients are poor whites). But the fact remains that as long as it's legal, it's not fraud.

Look at it this way. Let's say I have a business idea. I'm pretty certain that it's not legal to do it a certain way, so I consult with an attorney, who tells me a legal way to accomplish the same ends. Have I done anything wrong?

Soon after my divorce, I lost a pretty good job. I had agreed to fairly generous alimony and support terms. With the meter running at ~$1K a month, I got behind on my alimony and child support. Most fathers who owe child support do so because of a lost job. My ex has been very understanding of my situation, and I'm doing the best that I can right now and she appreciates it, but the arrearage reached a statutory level that allows the Friend of the Court system here to jerk my chain regardless of my ex's wishes. After working for a small company most of last year (and FOC taking 50% of everything I earned) I'm been trying to reactivate a couple of small businesses. Since they can't sieze a paycheck if you are self-employed, FOC put a lien against my small business checking account, effectively putting me out of business (no way to move funds from Paypal into real cash, couldn't take checks from customers), and then ordered me into a jobs program because they prefer employees with paychecks that can be garnished (sp?). For most of this past winter and spring I was forced to waste four hours a day sending out resumes that never got read. Southeast Michigan is the second worst job market in the country. Meanwhile, I had some paying customers waiting for jobs to be finished and goods to be shipped, and wasting 5 hours a day wasn't helping things.

So when I found out that as a participant in this program, the state would reimburse me for the cost of some of my car insurance and car repairs, should I not have had them do it? Okay, so I despise gov't programs like this, but I don't want to be a schmuck.

I think we are approaching ain l'davar sof territory with some of these things. Some things are clearly over the line, but the law is the law and a clever maneuvering through the bureaucracy (sp?) is not fraud.

Bayom Hahu Yitoka Beshofar Godol said...

"Why must we wait for Mashiach ben Dovid AND ben Yosef for a yeshiva to ever admit a mistake?"

Are there any present-day roshei yeshiva who are like the saints of the alter heim who do not take a penny for themselves? Or are all roshei yeshiva running a for profit enterprise that must be protected at all costs? R' Chaim Volozhiner's first and only allegiance was to the Torah. If there was a molester brought to R' Chaim's attention, surely the well being of the bochurim would come first. The R' Yossel Possuls of this world don't want to give up their luxury expense accounts and access to slush funds so that they may buy dwellings and vacation real estate for the entire extended family and other miscellaneous items that they dip into the cookie jar for. The hayntigge cover ups might not even all be premeditated. The enterpreneur roshei yeshiva might be subconsciously forced into the state of denial through redifas hagashmius.

Auto Report World Editors said...

UOJ asks,

IS THE ENTIRE JEWISH WORLD ON MIND-DISTORTING DRUGS????????

UOJ, most of the dopers that I know don't think too highly of child molestors and their enablers.

I'm genuinely intrigued at the idea of interviewing Rabbi Abraham Twerski M.D. on the subject of sexual abuse in the Jewish community. Since he openly acknowledges that religious Jews can suffer from the same pathologies, like substance abuse, as goyim, and as a psychiatrist is no doubt aware of the almost 100% recidivism rate with pedophiles, I really wonder what he would say about the wisdom of letting our "leaders" "handle" matters.

Anonymous said...

R' Shmuel Kaminetzky could be technically correct about molesters doing teshuva, but there is another problem which I will get to below. There is a shita, the Mabit I believe, that trying to stop your aveirahs while only sometimes succeeding is considered teshuva. R' Aron Kotler holds that the Mabit's chiddush may possibly suffice for the purpose of Yom Kippur.

A rosh yeshiva who is related to R' Shmuel once told me that some of unzerre gedolim, even the greatest among them, are not familiar with and do not have a clue about abuse issues. There was a time when Klal Yisroel could rely on ANY gadol for any issue, but in the yeridas hadoros, there are issues that must be left to competant professionals. The professionals will tell you that Yudi Kolko and friends are sick people who must be kept away from children even if they do try to battle their unusual yetzer. Maybe Rav Kaminetzky sincerely believes that Kolko could turn over a new leaf. In depth Knowledge of the type of sickness that afflicts Kolko dictates otherwise.

Anonymous said...

Here is a question for you people who keep telling is how great this fingerprinting of Rabbis and teachers is. What good will this do for us? Do you think if YTT had background checks on Kolko they would have found something? Or NIRC? They have neo files or records because NO ONE HAS EVER GONE TO THE POLICE. So big deal if parents start asking yeshivas to do background checks. They will come up blank, and then molesters will be able to et at their buffet of little boy ass!! And when their protectors and enables are questions and faced with why they haven’t done anything, they will say we ran background checks. This gives them a wall to hid behind of.

What needs to be done, as someone previously has mentioned, is to get a law passed that Rabbis are required to report any claims of sexual abuse. This will then lead to investigations, to convictions, and then to records.

YU is Not Utopia said...

Boog wrote YU's and R' J.B. Soloveitchik's praises on the last thread while trashing other yeshivos on abuse cover ups. There was a cover up in YU about 40 years ago of abuses by a ger who had YU facilitated access to minors. (Not a Gerrorist chosid, but a convert). It could very well be that the YU scandal predated those at any other yeshiva in the neye medina.

Ask rabbi grads who were there at the time. One of the roshei yeshiva excused the abuse by saying that the ger "doesn't know" how to behave properly because of his background, whatever the hell that is supposed to mean.

Tuvya said...

"if there are no new allegations of Kolko's abusing kids in the last FEW MONTHS, we must assume Kolko did tshuva."?????"


UOJ,

That comment makes no sense and I dont belive that he said it. But what if he said YEARS instead of months. Are you aware that while the rates of recidvism for pedophilia are unfortunately high, they are still far from 100%. Can we assume that Teshuva is definitely impossible if there has been nothing in years.

I am just asking. I dont know myself and I def. am not commenting on the Kolko case.

Orthorev is a mental disorder said...

Orthorev and UOJ are sick pieces of crap who deserve to rot in Gehinnom for ruining people's lives. Orthorev is a mental disorder.

Anonymous said...

Ortho,

The problem is that IT is not spoken about at all - meaning it is looked at as being abnormal. By IT, I mean sex, attraction to girs, etc.

Un-Orthodox Jew said...

Yeshiva Dustup

A lawyer who battled the church takes on the Orthodox establishment
By Forrest Norman
July 13, 2006

http://www.miaminewtimes.com/Issues/2006-07-13/news/metro2.html

boog said...

Awaiting part 2 already dish it out let's ruin another few people's lives. Another bit of dirty words, name calling, Loshon hora, and more aveiros please faster I just can't wait.

Un-Orthodox Jew said...

I need to get information from Rabbi Abba Gorelick from South Fallsburg today.
I will have someone contact him on my behalf.
Please, anyone that can e-mail me or post his phone number, please do!
Thanks....

Anonymous said...

Tuvia, teshuva bain adam lachaveiro is only when you ask mechila and it is granted. To our knowledge, Kolko has done no such thing.

Anonymous said...

is that IT?

I'm shocked. I would never have guessed. I've been trying. Different people have differing opinions, so uoj said. But, gosh, gollee, who would have imagined he meant THAT?

Thank you for enlightening me and the world.

Truth be told, it's not looked upon as abnormal, but as bummish. You want to be a bum, or a bummie girl, be a bum.

It's an old Yiddish folk song. Ich vill zingn l'cho doidee. ihr velt zingn biddie be a bum."

Anonymous said...

Gorelick, Meshulim Rabbi
Laurel Park Rd
South Fallsburg, NY
(845) 434-8121

Close enough?

An admirer (The 1 u helped last week. Thanx 4ever.)

Anonymous said...

Gorelick, Aba Rabbi
South Fallsburg, NY 12779
(845) 434-8125

Then I found this 1

Anonymous said...

boog, I hope that was sarcastic. You have contributed well to the cause and I admire your satire.

Anonymous said...

The Gorelicks own the town.

Doesn't the mayor deserve a letter, uoj? Wouldn't you take more seriously something official rather than a saying from ben blog blog of the internet?

Anonymous said...

The issue with the quote from Reb Shmuel is not that it flies in the face of scientific evidence.

It's that it goes against the halacha that every cheder kid has already learned, that Aviros Beyn Adam L'chavero require Bakashas Mchilla from the victim. I don't think that denial, intimidation, blaming the victim, etc. really is even going in the same direction as the halacha demands.

There probably is some kind of tshuva that pedophiles can do, but let's get real PULEASE!!! First a full admission and contrite apology. Then we'll talk about tikkunim.

ADMITNOTHING said...

Try one of these, I'm sure they can help you:

Meshulem Gorelick
Laurel Park Rd
South Fallsburg, NY
(845) 434-8121

Isser Gorelick
3 Yeshiva Ln
Fallsburg, NY 12733-5001
(845) 434-3255

Pinchas Scheinberg (no penetration no harm done) said...

I am sure you are smarter than me but zabbasearch.com (the stalkers favorite tool) say:




ABBA Z GORELICK Born 1943 More Information
(845) 434-8125

Anonymous said...

meshulem ia abba's bro

again anyone with info on south fallsburg please contact

helpyeshivaboys@yahoo.com

Anonymous said...

Also try 845-434-5240

just me said...

Rabbi Abba Gorelick

Home 845-434-8125

Office 845-434-5240

Anonymous said...

I believe Rav Abba is 434-8125

Anonymous said...

How cruel frum jews are! I can't even thank UOJ and the others who helped me. I would tell the world of the good work they do for survivors of yeshiva molestation, were it not for those speaking Loshon Hora and rechilus, spreading lies about the victims instead of confronting the fact they were taken for a ride by the rabbis and enablers.

Un-Orthodox Jew said...

To the reader that wants me to put up a post about a certain yeshiva,

Regardless of what the "holy" rabbis may be telling everyone, I will not put up, or name a yeshiva or abuser unless I have overwhelming evidence that the allegations are factual.

If you wish to report a school or an abuser, please e-mail credible and verifiable information to me. I'm not ignoring you but I need real hard facts. I know you understand.
Thanks.

Anonymous said...

uoj,
should we assume that waterbury has done its SPRING CLEANING?

Anonymous said...

http://abusedhassid.blogspot.com

boog said...

That 'boog' above was not me. Doesn't sound or write like me.

Can't debate 'em, impersonate 'em to discredit them.

I have a sufficient track record of postings on this blog for you to know I don't make those types of comments.

I am the real boog. (Hey, I'm beginning to sound like Jackie Mason; Excuse me while I lie down on the couch).

Un-Orthodox Jew said...

For various reasons, there will not be a posting tonight about any new problematic yeshiva. I will be putting up a new post long after midnight, part two of the attorney's post.

Anonymous said...

For various reasons, don't you, therefore, owe some kind of apology to Ner? Did your P.I. provide you with photographs? If not, how were those allegations better verified than any other allegations? Mah nishtana halaila hazeh mikol ha lay lows?

Pinchas Scheinberg AKA The De-penetrator said...

I am afraid that the powers that be eventually got into UOJ. Please reassure us that you are still the judge, jury, and executioner…

Anonymous said...

"Completely legal loophole...", is that something like:

"No Penetration - No Molestation"?

Anonymous said...

uoj, like the Gd he serves, does not change. He neither slumbers, nor, sleeps, wrath pours from his nostrils. He is invincible.

Anonymous said...

>That comment makes no sense and I dont belive that he said it. But what if he said YEARS instead of months. Are you aware that while the rates of recidvism for pedophilia are unfortunately high, they are still far from 100%. Can we assume that Teshuva is definitely impossible if there has been nothing in years.

How is it possible to achieve teshuva in a ben adam le-havero without seeking mechila? How can it be assumed that a molester who never sought mechila from his victims did teshuva? What teshuva?

Anonymous said...

maybe doing teshuva means WRITING a teshuva, and this they may do or have done.

What was the question?

boog said...

"Are you aware that while the rates of recidvism for pedophilia are unfortunately high, they are still far from 100%."

How "far" is far? As "far" as "farkrumt"?

Classic 'Shafranitis' and pure unadulterated KaKa.

Run this pablum by a molested kid. I'm sure he'll be totally understanding and turn the other cheek in forgiveness.

Anonymous said...

the bais hamikdosh was destroyed bec of sinas chinam..now is the 3 weeks...israel is at war...sinas chinam mean anything to u??
this page is evil and causes sinas chinam.
when posting think about the ramifications in israel might be?

Anonymous said...

but, what about your sinas chinam of our sinas chinam?

huh?

aren't we entitled to a little honesty?

if this page is evil, so are the acts that caused this page to be written. If this is sinas chinam, you're perverse.

This page is not responsible for hizbullah. This page is not responsible for the drama played out about between Israel and her enemies, displaying Hashem's Presence in History for the world. This page is about serious problems, pikuach nefesh issues. UOJ, assuming his sources are legit, is not evil, quite the opposite.

Don't fool yourself into thinking that the people who ignore problems care more and are headed for oilam haba. Not so.

You understand the workings of Hashem's world so well. You should be a member of the moetzes.

Israeli Putz said...

http://news.aol.com/article/parents-forget-3-year-old-at-airport/115685

JERUSALEM (Aug. 4) - Israeli airport police say a couple going on a European vacation remembered to bring their duty-free shopping and their 18 suitcases, but forgot their 3-year-old daughter at the airport.

The couple and their five children were late for a flight to Paris Sunday and made a mad dash to the gate. In the confusion, their daughter got lost. A policeman found her wandering around the terminal, crying for her mother.
Israeli media report Monday that the ultra-Orthodox Jewish parents, whose names were not released, didn't notice the child was missing until they were told, in the air, that she had been found at Ben-Gurion airport.

The child, accompanied by an airline staffer, took the next flight to Paris where she was safely reunited with her parents.

Copyright 2008 The Associated Press.

Heads Up said...

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/04/business/04lend.html

August 4, 2008

Housing Lenders Fear Bigger Wave of Loan Defaults

By VIKAS BAJAJ
The first wave of Americans to default on their home mortgages appears to be cresting, but a second, far larger one is quickly building.

Homeowners with good credit are falling behind on their payments in growing numbers, even as the problems with mortgages made to people with weak, or subprime, credit are showing their first, tentative signs of leveling off after two years of spiraling defaults.

The percentage of mortgages in arrears in the category of loans one rung above subprime, so-called alternative-A mortgages, quadrupled to 12 percent in April from a year earlier. Delinquencies among prime loans, which account for most of the $12 trillion market, doubled to 2.7 percent in that time.

The mortgage troubles have been exacerbated by an economy that is still struggling. Reports last week showed another drop in home prices, slower-than-expected economic growth and a huge loss at General Motors. On Friday, the Labor Department reported that the unemployment rate in July climbed to a four-year high.

While it is difficult to draw precise parallels among various segments of the mortgage market, the arc of the crisis in subprime loans suggests that the problems in the broader market may not peak for another year or two, analysts said.

Defaults are likely to accelerate because many homeowners’ monthly payments are rising rapidly. The higher bills come as home prices continue to decline and banks tighten their lending standards, making it harder for people to refinance loans or sell their homes. Of particular concern are “alt-A” loans, many of which were made to people with good credit scores without proof of their income or assets.

“Subprime was the tip of the iceberg,” said Thomas H. Atteberry, president of First Pacific Advisors, a investment firm in Los Angeles that trades mortgage securities. “Prime will be far bigger in its impact.”

In a conference call with analysts last month, James Dimon, the chairman and chief executive of JPMorgan Chase, said he expected losses on prime loans at his bank to triple in the coming months and described the outlook for them as “terrible.”

Does UOJ know? said...

Which member of Agudas Harabbonim is Shmarya referring to that had a meat company named after him?:

I'm told this is how the Agriprocessors-paid junket to Postville worked.

The rabbis – all hand-picked by Agriprocessors, its paid consultants or supporters – were given a guided tour of the plant by a Rubashkin. Then they were given access and told to go anywhere in the plant on their own and look at anything they wanted to.

This assured the rabbis that the plant is, in fact kosher – at least as far as the technical aspects of the meat produced.

After that, rabbis met with Jim Martin, Agriprocessors "compliance officer," and Agriprocessors new safety consultant. Martin blamed recent employee related issues (i.e., the homeless workers debacle) on a Texas staffing firm (presumably Bravo), and said the firms the company now works with all use the e-Verify system so all new workers are presumably legal.

At the intercession of locals, the rabbis were offered an off-trip side visit to St. Paul's Lutheran Church to meet (in a side room) with former Agriprocessors workers and the people who have been feeding, housing and caring for them for 2 1/2 months.

The vast majority of the rabbis refused that offer and did not meet with these former workers or those who care for them.

In the end, four rabbis met with two representatives of St. Bridget's, the Catholic Church coordinating food, housing and medical care for former (and even current) Agriprocessors workers.

UPDATE 2: No former or current workers were present. I'm told the two invited rabbis refused to meet with former workers or with current workers outside of Agriprocessors grounds.

UPDATE 1: state of the Jews' claim, posted below, that only two rabbis were invited because no one knew for sure who was on the trip is only partially true.

It is true only two rabbis were invited. Both were chosen because their participation was already public last week. Obviously, one of those rabbis was Pesach Lerner, the EVP of Young Israel.

Lerner and the other rabbi "invited" all other rabbis to attend, knowing full well to attend, most would have to miss their flights back home. Only two of those agreed, both of who probably drove to Postville so the delay made no significant difference.

Lerner and three other rabbis did go to that meeting. What they heard confirms much of what has been posted here over the past 2 1/2 months.



But knowing with relative certainty the composition of that small group, I can bet you you won't hear much about those abuses from them, even though those rabbis heard about empty paychecks with huge deductions taken for rent, of abuses and degradations, of forced unpaid overtime, of child labor, of a dangerous workplace and no safety training or protective gear, and other items from the litany of abuses known as Agriprocessors.

At least one of these rabbis thinks the Rubashkin family can "make it up" to these former workers.

But "making it up" involves Rubashkins paying out hundreds of thousands of dollars in unpaid overtime, sick leave, breaks and vacation pay – something the Rubashkins will certainly refuse to do – and it also involves paying the local food shelf and other organizations a serious chunk of money to make up for the losses taken by feeding, housing, clothing and nursing former and current Agriprocessors workers.

Past that, it is nearly impossible logistically to make this type of restitution, even when a company is willing and trustworthy – and Agriprocessors is neither.

All this begs a question.

These worker abuses were clearly widespread. They involve breaking many US laws and several halakhot, Jewish laws, as well. These abuses were systemic and took place continually over a period of years.

How can the kashrut of Agriprocessors be trusted when its owners and managers are criminals in the eyes of secular and Jewish law?

If the answer to that question is. "We trust the supervising rabbis – Weissmandal, the OU, Crown Heights Beis Din, etc.," how can that trust still remain?

These supervising rabbis ignored or simply failed to notice 13 year old workers. The failed to notice employees who were refused breaks, who were made to work forced unpaid overtime, who were constantly threatened and berated by supervisors, and who had no safety equipment.

It was as if clear violations of US and Jewish law did not matter to these supervising rabbis, as long as those violations did not effect the technical kosher status of the meat.

Rabbis like these cannot be trusted for anything. Their blind eyes can just as easily be turned to mislabeled product and salting times, as well.

I once worked a kosher processing plant as a mashgiach. The plant made hot dogs, kishke, bologna, and other deli products.

The USDA inspectors repeatedly warned employees not to pick up raw meat that had fallen from the production line and put it back into production. I did the same.

For the USDA, it was a health issue. For me, it was a kashrut issue. I did not want employees to tamper with a system that had its entry point closely supervised but its long middle much less so. And I also saw the open violation of USDA regulations as an indication of how employees (and management) treated kosher regulations when the mashgichim and rabbis were not close by.

But the Rav HaMachshir, the man whose name was on those deli meats, disagreed. His representative told me the Rav HaMachshir saw no difficulties when employees disregarded or flaunted USDA regulations. The Rav HaMachshir did not much care for the idea that nothing should be added by an employee to the production line except at its well supervised entry point, or much farther down the line where spices were added. According to his representative, the Rav HaMachshir felt that level of control was unnecessary.

I pointed out that it was just as easy for a worker to take a piece of meat that fell off a salting combo and toss it onto the line, still in its salt, or, for that matter, a piece of never-salted meat onto the line and into a salami.

That point, true as it was, was lost on the Rav HaMachshir. (Presumably this was so because any such piece would be battel, negated, by the majority.)

Also lost on the Rav HaMachshir was the point that accustoming workers to follow rules is important. This rabbi also did not grasp the idea that turning a blind eye to violations of US law and regulation was a corrosive thing, both for workers and for on-site mashgichim and rabbis.

Morality and ethics were not Rav HaMachshir's strong suits.

The Rav HaMachshir was a vice president of Agudath HaRabbonim when Rabbi Moshe Feinstein was its president.

This type of moral compartmentalization, the idea that salting times are sacrosanct while a worker's amputated hand is not, is something wholly new in Judaism, something more revolutionary than any of the reforms pushed for by the early Reform movement or by the Conservative Movement through much of the 1950s. It turns halakha on its head.

And that should make the meat produced by Agriprocessors as treife as a Bacon, Lettuce and Tomato sandwich.

Many Jews know this instinctively.

murray huberfeld says said...

How come nobody is talking about the near crash of my private jet last week with all the choshuv people on board?

Agudah Fresser said...

Let's see how many deli producers are named for people:

Abeles & Heymann Gourmet Kosher Provisions was formed in 1954 by Oscar Abeles and his nephew Leopold Heymann.

Levitt's went out of business about 5 years ago.

Rubashkin makes Nathan's Famous, named for alter Poylisher Yid Nathan Handwerker who came to Brooklyn in 1912.

Perl's, named for Hershel Perl, a Hungarian in Toronto, eidim of the Strettiner Rebbe.

Wise Kosher named for Wiesenfeld.

Soglowek named after an old Yekki.

David Bodner said...

Huberfeld,

are you talking about the private plane crash in Wisconsin that killed a bunch of executives from Tishman-Speyer?

What did you have to do with it?

VIN said...

Brooklyn, NY - A hard-hitting follow-up to the subject of sexual abuse and molestation in the Orthodox community was heard on Assemblyman Dov Hikind’s radio show this past Motzoei Shabbos.

Hikind opened the first of several sharply-worded salvos heard throughout the program against perpetrators in the frum world.

After expressing his admiration for cheder rebbis for making a difference, Hikind asserted that “My office is committed to doing something. I have actually assigned staff members to work on this. We are going to stick with this. Those who are abusing our children, doing inappropriate things, I’m coming after you in every single way. Quit before your name is released and your family is embarrassed! I will not be silent or shy away.

Hikind then introduced a Williamburg mother whose son had been molested by his menahel at age 8.5 and left Yiddishkeit at 19 as a result. Most significantly, the mother related the years of devastation, isolation, shame and lack of trust in Torah authority figures. “It was a betrayal of his beliefs,” reports the mother.

After a lengthy discussion on how the victim’s family tried to get the menahel to treatment without embarrassing his own family, which didn’t work, the mother reported that even though the menahel failed a lie detector test and was temporarily removed from his position, he has been returned to teaching in summer school and will be returning to yeshivah in September.

Throughout the program, an audibly outraged Hikind raised his voice and said (among other things):

· “…How can one of the most prominent yeshivos, that educates tens of thousands of kids, know they have a molester destroying people’s lives! How can they continue with him? How’s that possible? … Well, we are going to stop him, okay? … We are going to stop that from happening. Period. But that’s not the point. The point is: What is their thinking? Where is their religiosity and their commitment?”

· “Is there anyone out there who accepts abuse of children? This mother tried to do things in a beautiful way, and they betrayed her son again. They just hoped she would go away. Her son felt, ‘Maybe I accomplished something, maybe I got rid of this skunk!’ Then he finds that a person who is sick and who should never be with children again is back on his job? How do you face G-d now? How do you pray in the morning?”

· “My office is devoted to this. We are asking people to come forward… We have staff working on this. We are building cases and cases and cases. The stories that I have heard this week, all from our communities from Lakewood to Monsey to Borough Park to Flatbush.”

· “You know, I gotta tell you. You ask me, ‘How are you?’ I must be honest. I have not been okay since last Shabbos night since doing this show. Because it affects me profoundly to listen, to listen and to listen. And you know what’s putting a dagger through my heart? It’s that people are more interested in protecting the perpetrator than dealing with the victim! That’s the part that’s putting a dagger through my heart and soul.”

The show concluded with the mention of Beth Israel’s new Sexual Abuse Hotline, 212-844-1495, and several calls from supportive and grateful abuse victims.

Of particularly notable mention was Hikind’s reaction to a caller named Yitz, who asked the mother, “Why don’t you go to the police? And why is this sub-human still on the streets?” Hikind replied: “In her case, they are trying to get him out of a classroom. It’s about getting him away from kids, and I have spoken to quite a few rabbonim and you have every right to do this legally. The first objective is to get this guy out of the classroom. If I have to go public, if I have to hold a press conference outside the yeshivah, I will do that! This guy is not going back to the classroom in September. We will make sure that will not happen.”

Dr. Asher Lipner said...

Halacha requires reporting child molesters directly to the police.

Eckstein the Putz said...

http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/article.php?p=21862

Here's my report that helps Pesach Lerner & the whitewash crew cast Rubashkin in a favorable light. My pal Lubinsky will be proud.

Herschel Perl said...

http://perls.ca/about.htm

Actually, I'm Roumanian.

Click here and I'll zing a niggun for you.

Anonymous said...

VIN Reports on Dov Hikind's Radio Program...

Brooklyn, NY - Dov Hikind Puts Yeshivas On Notice With Harsh Warning: I am Going To Publicly Shame You If You Harbor Rebbe Molesters

08-04-2008 - 9:28 AM



Brooklyn, NY - A hard-hitting follow-up to the subject of sexual abuse and molestation in the Orthodox community was heard on Assemblyman Dov Hikind’s radio show this past Motzoei Shabbos.

Hikind opened the first of several sharply-worded salvos heard throughout the program against perpetrators in the frum world.

After expressing his admiration for cheder rebbis for making a difference, Hikind asserted that “My office is committed to doing something. I have actually assigned staff members to work on this. We are going to stick with this. Those who are abusing our children, doing inappropriate things, I’m coming after you in every single way. Quit before your name is released and your family is embarrassed! I will not be silent or shy away.

To listen to the entire show which lasts for about a full hour click below


Hikind then introduced a Williamburg mother whose son had been molested by his menahel at age 8.5 and left Yiddishkeit at 19 as a result. Most significantly, the mother related the years of devastation, isolation, shame and lack of trust in Torah authority figures. “It was a betrayal of his beliefs,” reports the mother.

After a lengthy discussion on how the victim’s family tried to get the menahel to treatment without embarrassing his own family, which didn’t work, the mother reported that even though the menahel failed a lie detector test and was temporarily removed from his position, he has been returned to teaching in summer school and will be returning to yeshivah in September.

Throughout the program, an audibly outraged Hikind raised his voice and said (among other things):

· “…How can one of the most prominent yeshivos, that educates tens of thousands of kids, know they have a molester destroying people’s lives! How can they continue with him? How’s that possible? … Well, we are going to stop him, okay? … We are going to stop that from happening. Period. But that’s not the point. The point is: What is their thinking? Where is their religiosity and their commitment?”

· “Is there anyone out there who accepts abuse of children? This mother tried to do things in a beautiful way, and they betrayed her son again. They just hoped she would go away. Her son felt, ‘Maybe I accomplished something, maybe I got rid of this skunk!’ Then he finds that a person who is sick and who should never be with children again is back on his job? How do you face G-d now? How do you pray in the morning?”

· “My office is devoted to this. We are asking people to come forward… We have staff working on this. We are building cases and cases and cases. The stories that I have heard this week, all from our communities from Lakewood to Monsey to Borough Park to Flatbush.”

· “You know, I gotta tell you. You ask me, ‘How are you?’ I must be honest. I have not been okay since last Shabbos night since doing this show. Because it affects me profoundly to listen, to listen and to listen. And you know what’s putting a dagger through my heart? It’s that people are more interested in protecting the perpetrator than dealing with the victim! That’s the part that’s putting a dagger through my heart and soul.”

The show concluded with the mention of Beth Israel’s new Sexual Abuse Hotline, 212-844-1495, and several calls from supportive and grateful abuse victims.

Of particularly notable mention was Hikind’s reaction to a caller named Yitz, who asked the mother, “Why don’t you go to the police? And why is this sub-human still on the streets?” Hikind replied: “In her case, they are trying to get him out of a classroom. It’s about getting him away from kids, and I have spoken to quite a few rabbonim and you have every right to do this legally. The first objective is to get this guy out of the classroom. If I have to go public, if I have to hold a press conference outside the yeshivah, I will do that! This guy is not going back to the classroom in September. We will make sure that will not happen.”

Anonymous said...

...Murray...shhh...

I thought you said we would keep this quiet.

Got to be careful...if those "crack" journalists at Yeshiva World hear about this then everyone will know...especially if there are pictures (of Rabonnim or Hatzalah) involved.

Hey YW...what do you think of Hatzolah action figures? Would make great Chanukah presents. Kids could trade them too.

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